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Post by Father of Dragons on May 22, 2015 9:57:03 GMT
Wow. I guess all the much more graphic Theon torture scenes just weren't memorable enough. That line for me confirms that the lady who wrote the article doesn't actually watch GoT. She just saw the kerfuffle and hopped in on the bandwagoning knowing very well that the name "game of thrones" means a ton of page-views than the name "outlander' does by itself. So instead of just writing about the show she is watching, she decided that she could just critique GoT based on secondhand fucking info. :poop:
It's clear she watches a less-popular variant of Game of Thrones called "Gmae of Thrones", which aims only to objectify women and allow males to have the time of their lives
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Post by Admin on May 22, 2015 10:14:10 GMT
I love it when you get angry Sadly anger is all I can really contribute to any discussion of the backlash to the scene in question. I just HATE these silly tag-along, platitude-regurgitating, nauseating, fucking annoying, supposed critics. While my response to their bullshit is as one-note as their analysis really...I still feel the need to chime in. I actually have some readers on my blog who expressed their intent of not watching the show anymore over that scene, so I'm looking forward to linking that one awesome article debunking the negative points, hopefully they'll see it and reconsider. It's just so premature to quit the show now or even write about this scene at all if we don't know what happens later. That something awful happens to the character one loves is pretty bad reason imho to quit a series you've spent 4+ years with. If I followed the outrage path, given what they've done to Cat - handful of screentime in s2,s3, not bringing her back, having her daughter raped and she might have been wearing Cat's wedding dress during this - I should not only quit but burn the DVDs and take a dump on them.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2015 10:29:47 GMT
I actually have some readers on my blog who expressed their intent of not watching the show anymore over that scene, so I'm looking forward to linking that one awesome article debunking the negative points, hopefully they'll see it and reconsider. It's just so premature to quit the show now or even write about this scene at all if we don't know what happens later. That something awful happens to the character one loves is pretty bad reason imho to quit a series you've spent 4+ years with. If I followed the outrage path, given what they've done to Cat - handful of screentime in s2,s3, not bringing her back, having her daughter raped and she might have been wearing Cat's wedding dress during this - I should not only quit but burn the DVDs and take a dump on them. I don't take people's threats to quit the show seriously. GrrM has said that people used to send him letters/emails saying they'd stopped reading or even burned his books because they'd made them upset when they wanted something more positive from what they read instead. He's also said that a good many of those same people later said that they'd bought the books all over again just to see what happened next. (To which he said he was glad that they'd bought the books twice because that meant twice the money for him). The same is true for the show.
The people who quit the show, even that U.S. senator, no matter how many weeks they quit for will come back eventually when they hear all of their friends discussing Cersei's arrest and Hardhome and Daznak's Pit and For the Watch and all the great moments they'll miss out on if they persist in their silly boycotts.
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Post by Admin on May 22, 2015 10:42:17 GMT
I actually have some readers on my blog who expressed their intent of not watching the show anymore over that scene, so I'm looking forward to linking that one awesome article debunking the negative points, hopefully they'll see it and reconsider. It's just so premature to quit the show now or even write about this scene at all if we don't know what happens later. That something awful happens to the character one loves is pretty bad reason imho to quit a series you've spent 4+ years with. If I followed the outrage path, given what they've done to Cat - handful of screentime in s2,s3, not bringing her back, having her daughter raped and she might have been wearing Cat's wedding dress during this - I should not only quit but burn the DVDs and take a dump on them. I don't take people's threats to quit the show seriously. GrrM has said that people used to send him letters/emails saying they'd stopped reading or even burned his books because they'd made them upset when they wanted something more positive from what they read instead. He's also said that a good many of those same people later said that they'd bought the books all over again just to see what happened next. (To which he said he was glad that they'd bought the books twice because that meant twice the money for him). The same is true for the show.
The people who quit the show, even that U.S. senator, no matter how many weeks they quit for will come back eventually when they hear all of their friends discussing Cersei's arrest and Hardhome and Daznak's Pit and For the Watch and all the great moments they'll miss out on if they persist in their silly boycotts.
Maybe, but I think there are those who were serious. However I think those who will stay away from the show are not doing it just because of that reason - it can be the final straw, but never just "oh no, they did that, I'm not watching!". Either the show was starting to bore them or as book readers they were irritated but these who shout and throw 'not gonna watch anymore!' hissy fits are still gonna come back, watch it and bitch about it all over tumblr and westeros. I get people abandoning the show because they don't have the time (reason I don't watch Modern Family, Grey's Anatomy and dozens of others), find the show too awful to endure (True Blood's later seasons), boring or offensive (Girls), but jumping the ship over one scene is just excessive, if you are gonna spend the equivalent of time that it would probably take on marathoning the whole series on complaining on social media
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Post by kingeomer on May 22, 2015 10:51:20 GMT
Yeah, I don't see how any regular viewer could forget scenes that more closely qualified as torture porn. What a crock. I have no desire to watch Outlander, but from what I've read of Jamie's torture, praising it as feminist sounds pretty sick. There is nothing feminist about what happens to Jamie Fraser in Outlander books or show. Anyone who says that needs to have their head checked. Having Claire there at some point does not make the scene more "feminist". I don't want to derail this thread with Outlander stuff but here are two critic comments that have some criticism for the show (I guess and books) for the use of rape as well. I had said that not criticizing Outlander would be hypocritical of critics since they are really having a go at GoT...so I have to eat my words a little. But if the shows are going to criticized, then the authors should be too. www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/tvandradioblog/2015/may/20/outlander-highland-flings-time-travel-have-you-been-watching?CMP=share_btn_tw (this one you are going to have to click on the picture in her tweet the includes some of her comments. Sati, well done on your comments to indiewire.
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Post by kingeomer on May 22, 2015 10:55:07 GMT
I don't take people's threats to quit the show seriously. GrrM has said that people used to send him letters/emails saying they'd stopped reading or even burned his books because they'd made them upset when they wanted something more positive from what they read instead. He's also said that a good many of those same people later said that they'd bought the books all over again just to see what happened next. (To which he said he was glad that they'd bought the books twice because that meant twice the money for him). The same is true for the show.
The people who quit the show, even that U.S. senator, no matter how many weeks they quit for will come back eventually when they hear all of their friends discussing Cersei's arrest and Hardhome and Daznak's Pit and For the Watch and all the great moments they'll miss out on if they persist in their silly boycotts.
Maybe, but I think there are those who were serious. However I think those who will stay away from the show are not doing it just because of that reason - it can be the final straw, but never just "oh no, they did that, I'm not watching!". Either the show was starting to bore them or as book readers they were irritated but these who shout and throw 'not gonna watch anymore!' hissy fits are still gonna come back, watch it and bitch about it all over tumblr and westeros. I get people abandoning the show because they don't have the time (reason I don't watch Modern Family, Grey's Anatomy and dozens of others), find the show too awful to endure (True Blood's later seasons), boring or offensive (Girls), but jumping the ship over one scene is just excessive, if you are gonna spend the equivalent of time that it would probably take on marathoning the whole series on complaining on social media I think the show will lose viewers (not hardly enough that HBO should worry about ratings..) but I think there were viewers (like Claire Mc Caskell) who had a foot out the door before this episode aired and perhaps this past episode was the last straw for those viewers. And if it wasn't Sansa's rape, it would have been something else. Claire Mc Caskell also cited the Water Gardens as "dumb." Most of the people that I have heard saying they will no longer watch the show were people that were getting fed up/bored/just done before this episode aired. Those types of soon to ex-viewers can definitely be found for any television show, especially one in it's 5th season.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2015 11:02:23 GMT
I think the show will lose viewers (not hardly enough that HBO should worry about ratings..) but I think there were viewers (like Claire Mc Caskell) who had a foot out the door before this episode aired and perhaps this past episode was the last straw for those viewers. And if it wasn't Sansa's rape, it would have been something else. Claire Mc Caskell also cited the Water Gardens as "dumb." Most of the people that I have heard saying they will no longer watch the show were people that were getting fed up/bored/just done before this episode aired. Those types of soon to ex-viewers can definitely be found for any television show, especially one in it's 5th season.That is true, but I think even those types would reconsider abandoning the show after they hear the last few episodes of the season being fervently discussed online. And even if they hold out after that, I imagine s6 will draw back quite a few abandonees.
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Post by 7timesdamnedshewolf on May 22, 2015 12:14:18 GMT
This is sort of off-topic but I was just getting into it with a rape-denier on another site and feel a need to vent because I had to be the bigger person and not tell her/him/it that they were a fucking piece of shit who should try getting fucked by Ramsay if they think it's so harmless.
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Post by Paid Debt Lannister on May 22, 2015 12:23:10 GMT
I think the show will lose viewers (not hardly enough that HBO should worry about ratings..) but I think there were viewers (like Claire Mc Caskell) who had a foot out the door before this episode aired and perhaps this past episode was the last straw for those viewers. And if it wasn't Sansa's rape, it would have been something else. Claire Mc Caskell also cited the Water Gardens as "dumb." Most of the people that I have heard saying they will no longer watch the show were people that were getting fed up/bored/just done before this episode aired. Those types of soon to ex-viewers can definitely be found for any television show, especially one in it's 5th season.That is true, but I think even those types would reconsider abandoning the show after they hear the last few episodes of the season being fervently discussed online. And even if they hold out after that, I imagine s6 will draw back quite a few abandonees. I agree. The problem is that some possible events, like Shireen, Stannis and Loras' deaths, and above all, Jon's death, may be factors for even more people to give up on the show. (Sorry to go a bit off-topic here, but there was an interview before the season started saying that 4 characters alive on the books would die this season, right? Or am I imagining things? Anyway, if so, we have Mance, Barristan and probably will have Meryn Trant.. That leaves space for only one more death this season, which gives hope to Stannis, Shireen and Loras' situation. Not sure what will happen to Jon, though.)
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2015 12:31:01 GMT
I think they said it was 4 major characters, so I'm not sure that Meryn Trant would qualify. I may be misremembering
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Post by Admin on May 22, 2015 12:35:01 GMT
I think they said it was 4 major characters, so I'm not sure that Meryn Trant would qualify. I may be misremembering I'd argue on the show Meryn is more major than Mance
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Post by Paid Debt Lannister on May 22, 2015 12:50:30 GMT
I think they said it was 4 major characters, so I'm not sure that Meryn Trant would qualify. I may be misremembering I'd argue on the show Meryn is more major than Mance Yeah, I was thinking that. But by the way their deaths were portrayed, I would say both Mance and Barristan count as "major deaths" here. That would leave two, if this information is to be trusted. I would say that the characters with the biggest "aims" on their heads are, in order: Meryn Trant - Bronn - Loras Tyrell - Mace Tyrell - Hizdahr zo Loraq - Stannis Baratheon - Shireen Baratheon - Ramsay Bolton - Brienne of Tarth - Tommen Baratheon As long as the Tyrells and Baratheons are spared, I don't think the audience will care much. Everybody loves Bronn but his death won't be seen as tragic and revolting, I guess. Anyway, there's still Jon there. That will hit a lot of Unsullied like a bomb.
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Post by Admin on May 22, 2015 12:54:01 GMT
Someone posted here on this board that Stephen's schedule is built around Thrones again. This is legit my only hope though I have no idea what the source for info is.
I don't think they will kill off Bronn - he is walking sass machine they can put in pretty much every storyline.
What of Grey Worm?
I think Loras may die.
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Post by Paid Debt Lannister on May 22, 2015 12:57:18 GMT
What of Grey Worm? I think Loras may die. I'm afraid of that too. Even though he is not very popular, having him getting killed by the "inquisition" because of being gay, with Grandma trying to save him, will not be good for the show I'm afraid. I pray to the many faced God that GW dies. I cannot stand him and Missandei. It truly hurts to see them onscreen.
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Post by day dreamer on May 22, 2015 13:02:06 GMT
Wow. I missed a lot yesterday. I really hope that Raw Story article gets more shares, because it's honestly one of the best things written about this mess. Like many of you said, some of these critics probably don't even watch the show. And I bet non of them said anything about Theon's near rape before he was castrated. (I remember quite a few book readers, including myself hating that scene) I actually had a friend that doesn't really watch the show ask if I was super pissed about that scene because she read how "misogynistic" it was.
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afarouk07
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Post by afarouk07 on May 22, 2015 21:34:03 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2015 6:53:47 GMT
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Post by kingeomer on May 23, 2015 13:16:13 GMT
That was a great comment and I know the show is not going to follow up with Sansa starting a rape survivors's group or killing Ramsey in the next episode. They have their flashpoint conversation with this one. Let's hope they take the ball and run with it in the episodes to follow with Sansa. I still think the direction for her is coming to the realization that to the Lannisters, Boltons, Littlefinger, Stannis and just about anyone else...they don't care about or what she desires, wants, needs...they care about her name and how she can help them secure the North. And does she come to the realization that she is only a pawn to these people and does she try to make that work for her in getting what she wants or does she say, no, I am done. I don't think that this is solved by the end of the season...but I do think we will see the wheels turning in her head about it and maybe she might confide in Theon or someone else at this point. When Littlefinger made his deal with Cersei, it would increasingly clear Sansa was collateral damage for him. He wants the North. He'll the kill the Boltons to appease Cersei's paranoia about them and get the Northmen on his side. I suspect it matters little to him if Sansa survives her sojourn to Winterfell. Because if the Vale army defeats the Boltons and he gets the credit, he thinks the North will follow him because he is a better alternative to them then the Boltons...Sansa or no Sansa.
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Post by AdmiralKyrd on May 24, 2015 3:59:36 GMT
<abbr>The four major characters will die that don't die in the books comment was never sourced.
</abbr>"Ramsay is not the bunny slope" is pretty good.
Also it should be noted Claire McCaskill has been voted before by congressional staffers as having the second most "tweet fails," in the Senate - whatever that means. She doesn't think before she tweets, I guess.
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Post by 7timesdamnedshewolf on May 24, 2015 5:50:26 GMT
I think my fave part of that is "GRR Martin’s claim that his POV characters now possess a special authorial shield against rape." I keep seeing it said that Martin won't have Sansa raped because apparently he said he's not interested in writing a rape PoV, and I just don't see how that's any better. The books are chock full of rape but is he really showing how bad it is by always having it happen to voiceless women and never really exploring it with any of them? The closest is Cersei, but that's marital rape from a villain's PoV and it's one passage buried in otherwise delusional narration, right before she assaults a woman herself.
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