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Post by Deleted on May 11, 2015 3:52:39 GMT
So uh. Does this change anything? Talk with me friends. Well, Sam's talk re Oldtown and the Citadel does give me a smidgeon of hope. (I know, I know, this is Game of Thrones. Hope? Am I delusional??) They have established a relationship between Shireen and Gilly, they had Shireen looking back at Gilly as she rode away, they gave us Sam's proclamation to Gilly that basically 'Whither thou goest, so I will go.' So my smidgeon of hope out of all this is that the photo we saw of Selyse on the ground looking distraught is because she's seeing or hearing that Shireen has disappeared just before she was to be burnt, gone with the wind, escaped with Sam, Gilly and baby Sam. Off to Oldtown.
I want to believe.
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valyrianshadow
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"Seat my daughter on the Iron Throne. Or die in the attempt."
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Post by valyrianshadow on May 11, 2015 4:17:06 GMT
So uh. Does this change anything? Talk with me friends. Well, Sam's talk re Oldtown and the Citadel does give me a smidgeon of hope. (I know, I know, this is Game of Thrones. Hope? Am I delusional??) They have established a relationship between Shireen and Gilly, they had Shireen looking back at Gilly as she rode away, they gave us Sam's proclamation to Gilly that basically 'Whither thou goest, so I will go.' So my smidgeon of hope out of all this is that the photo we saw of Selyse on the ground looking distraught is because she's seeing or hearing that Shireen has disappeared just before she was to be burnt, gone with the wind, escaped with Sam, Gilly and baby Sam. Off to Oldtown.
I want to believe.
I think we're on the same page about it. I think they're putting Shireen/Gilly in for a reason. We could be reading too much into it I guess but its possible. It just seems weird to me now that they'll take them to Winterfell and then go oh never mind go back to the Wall? Why take them at all then? Just to troll us? To say oh they'll be safer at the Wall oh wait oops? Ugh lol
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Post by Admin on May 11, 2015 4:25:25 GMT
Daddy will protect her.
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Post by Deleted on May 11, 2015 4:32:50 GMT
Well, Sam's talk re Oldtown and the Citadel does give me a smidgeon of hope. (I know, I know, this is Game of Thrones. Hope? Am I delusional??) They have established a relationship between Shireen and Gilly, they had Shireen looking back at Gilly as she rode away, they gave us Sam's proclamation to Gilly that basically 'Whither thou goest, so I will go.' So my smidgeon of hope out of all this is that the photo we saw of Selyse on the ground looking distraught is because she's seeing or hearing that Shireen has disappeared just before she was to be burnt, gone with the wind, escaped with Sam, Gilly and baby Sam. Off to Oldtown.
I want to believe.
I think we're on the same page about it. I think they're putting Shireen/Gilly in for a reason. We could be reading too much into it I guess but its possible. It just seems weird to me now that they'll take them to Winterfell and then go oh never mind go back to the Wall? Why take them at all then? Just to troll us? To say oh they'll be safer at the Wall oh wait oops? Ugh lol Well, I think the one factor we're not, well, factoring in here is... winter. Winter is, I believe, going to be a major player from here on out, til the end of the series. Winter is not Coming. Winter has Come. They can be a few days south of the Wall, enveloped by screaming winds, tents blowing away, horses foundering and breaking legs in deep snow, white-out blizzard conditions. Then, Stannis can order that his family be sent back to the Wall. It works, I think.
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Post by Deleted on May 11, 2015 4:46:47 GMT
Maybe Brienne has something to do with Shireen's return to the wall? If in fact she and Pod somehow manage to rescue Sansa from Winterfell and makes peace (or a bargain) with Stannis ... maybe they send her as escort for them to the Wall for Sansa to be with Jon and Shireen to be safer if things get bad at Winterfell as predicted? We know things were looking pretty bad for team Stannis at the end of ADWD - snowed in at some crofter's village. Remember the letter he sent back to the wall with the iron banker from Braavo? Maybe it's Brienne instead and he sends Shireen back with her? I'm going to guess he sends all the women, Mel included because it's getting bad there ... but the trip to the wall (and the weather) isn't going to be any better - so I really am just grasping at straws here!
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Post by Admin on May 19, 2015 9:16:33 GMT
In light of those Ramsay/Stannis fight this season rumours I looked back at that Shireen scene. I think that this scene exists for more than to mention stonemen and greyscale. It's mostly there to show how much Stannis cares about his daughter and putting an emphasis on her being his only child.
So what is the other purpose/foreshadowing there?
1. adding to Stannis' motivation - Ned Stark's daughter is in WF and needs to be rescued, Stannis respected Ned and Ned would do the same for his child 2. Shireen gets taken by Ramsay, while Sansa joins Stannis? Hostage situation? 3. Stannis dies protecting Shireen?
I really cannot imagine Shireen or Stannis dying this season, also I think Melisandre's words about lord of light needing her aren't empty - there must be some purpose to Shireen, perhaps in the light of greyscale epidemic some speculated? But it's really hard to come up with anything - Shireen is now marching with the army, that is most likely going to be attacked this season and if Stannis dies, where would she go?
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Post by day dreamer on May 19, 2015 12:10:36 GMT
In light of those Ramsay/Stannis fight this season rumours I looked back at that Shireen scene. I think that this scene exists for more than to mention stonemen and greyscale. It's mostly there to show how much Stannis cares about his daughter and putting an emphasis on her being his only child. So what is the other purpose/foreshadowing there? 1. adding to Stannis' motivation - Ned Stark's daughter is in WF and needs to be rescued, Stannis respected Ned and Ned would do the same for his child 2. Shireen gets taken by Ramsay, while Sansa joins Stannis? Hostage situation? 3. Stannis dies protecting Shireen?I really cannot imagine Shireen or Stannis dying this season, also I think Melisandre's words about lord of light needing her aren't empty - there must be some purpose to Shireen, perhaps in the light of greyscale epidemic some speculated? But it's really hard to come up with anything - Shireen is now marching with the army, that is most likely going to be attacked this season and if Stannis dies, where would she go?
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2015 12:20:06 GMT
We are all worried for Shireen. Especially since that scene with Selyse and Melisandre. What do you think will happen with her? Do you think she gets sacrificed? Would showing such a thing, even implying it be too much for HBO? Yeah, they killed a baby in 2x01 but this Shireen! No, no, no. The babies in 201 were genuine threats to the throne. Janos Slynt (PBUH) bravely took it upon himself to defeat them in battle. Such a brave man. Definitely not just a cowardly piece of shit. I think the series is teasing Shireen's death so they can swing it and have Stannis save her He didnt let Greyscale have her, he wont let Mel have her either!
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valyrianshadow
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"Seat my daughter on the Iron Throne. Or die in the attempt."
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Post by valyrianshadow on May 19, 2015 13:23:53 GMT
^^^ but what if Stannis isn't around? If Shireen/Mel/Selyse go back to the Wall there's nothing he can do. Davos could save her but he'll stay with Stannis probably. I highly doubt she'll be there for the tent burning. But it's possible.
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2015 13:34:09 GMT
So, I've assume forever that Stannis will die in the Battle of Winterfell. I've also heard people make good arguments for the Boltons dying. So, now I'm trying to guess based on what moves the plot best. If there were no more Stannis or no more Boltons, which force would be most lacking from the plot next season, the northern villains or the hero/king contender?
Edited to address the point of the OP: I can't talk you down. I fear for Shireen.
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Post by associatemaester on May 19, 2015 13:44:52 GMT
We are all worried for Shireen. Especially since that scene with Selyse and Melisandre. What do you think will happen with her? Do you think she gets sacrificed? Would showing such a thing, even implying it be too much for HBO? Yeah, they killed a baby in 2x01 but this Shireen! No, no, no. The babies in 201 were genuine threats to the throne. Janos Slynt (PBUH) bravely took it upon himself to defeat them in battle. Such a brave man. Definitely not just a cowardly piece of shit. I think the series is teasing Shireen's death so they can swing it and have Stannis save her He didnt let Greyscale have her, he wont let Mel have her either! I'd say the bigger concern is the flay-happy Bolton running around right now.
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Post by janicia on May 19, 2015 14:44:27 GMT
With 4 episodes left, I feel like Sansa, Theon, and Brienne's plot is largely accounted for this season. Sansa and Theon conspire to escape in 5x07 and light their candle, and Brienne helps them actually escape in 5x09ish. I don't see space for Shireen in what they're doing, so I doubt she is captured by the Boltons or Brienne. And presumably either Fat Walda or Myranda or both is going to be killed in an inter-Bolton power struggle. It doesn't make much sense to put Shireen inside Winterfell when there is already plenty going on there.
I also don't see her just being killed in a Ramsay raid. Shireen and Selyse could have easily been left at Dragonstone in season 3 for character economy. Melissandre's insistence that Shireen needs to come, Shireen's screen time at the Wall and the show's harping on greyscale all seem to be building toward something bigger than Ramsay suddenly slitting her throat.
I had hoped that Shireen would go with Sam and Gilly, but they are probably leaving the Wall soon and Shireen isn't likely to get back there in time to catch the boat. Anyway, the Night's Watch "kidnapping" Stannis' daughter would be a kind of bizarre plot point that would create a butterfly effect.
Melissandre vs. Davos is the most likely story with Shireen this season, with Yara as a possible wildcard, I think. Melissandre and Davos are both willing to go behind Stannis' back to do what they see as necessary regarding Shireen. And presumably Yara is going to emerge in the Stannis story at some point. The aftermath of whatever happens might be the reason that Melissandre ends up back at the Wall, or the reason that Davos goes off on solo adventures away from Stannis.
I'd also say that just because the show put a target on Shireen doesn't mean she's doomed anytime soon. The leach prophesy still hasn't paid off with Balon's death; Tommen and Myrcella are alive and well despite the shroud prophesy, Dany's baby died soon after the "Stallion that mounts the world" prophesy. I know there is a lot going on with the interpretation of many of the prophesies, I'm just saying that there has been misleading foreshadowing in the show, and the books absolutely revel in misdirection.
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Post by janicia on May 19, 2015 15:04:54 GMT
So, I've assume forever that Stannis will die in the Battle of Winterfell. I've also heard people make good arguments for the Boltons dying. So, now I'm trying to guess based on what moves the plot best. If there were no more Stannis or no more Boltons, which force would be most lacking from the plot next season, the northern villains or the hero/king contender? Edited to address the point of the OP: I can't talk you down. I fear for Shireen. My guess for season 6 is that somebody will obliterate the Freys, Dany will invade Westeros, and the White Walkers will get past the Wall. Stannis and the Boltons will all die in the excitement. I think anybody who doesn't get out of the north soon is toast. (Though I do think Davos and Sansa will both make it out in time, and Jon and Melissandre have their own survival mechanisms.) With Dany coming as the new hero/king contender, Stannis becomes less important in that role. Some of these struggles have to start wrapping up to make way for the final struggles. The Lannister / Tyrell struggle also needs to wrap up.
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2015 16:10:21 GMT
In light of those Ramsay/Stannis fight this season rumours I looked back at that Shireen scene. I think that this scene exists for more than to mention stonemen and greyscale. It's mostly there to show how much Stannis cares about his daughter and putting an emphasis on her being his only child. So what is the other purpose/foreshadowing there? 1. adding to Stannis' motivation - Ned Stark's daughter is in WF and needs to be rescued, Stannis respected Ned and Ned would do the same for his child 2. Shireen gets taken by Ramsay, while Sansa joins Stannis? Hostage situation? 3. Stannis dies protecting Shireen?I really cannot imagine Shireen or Stannis dying this season, also I think Melisandre's words about lord of light needing her aren't empty - there must be some purpose to Shireen, perhaps in the light of greyscale epidemic some speculated? But it's really hard to come up with anything - Shireen is now marching with the army, that is most likely going to be attacked this season and if Stannis dies, where would she go? This has now become my new favourite gif!
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Post by Deleted on May 24, 2015 22:08:14 GMT
Somebody put a compilation vid together, detailing all the hints the show has dropped about Shireen being... gaahhh, I can't even say it.
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Post by Admin on May 24, 2015 22:16:47 GMT
Nothing is happening to princess fawn
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Post by theonionsleight on May 24, 2015 22:45:14 GMT
Somebody put a compilation vid together, detailing all the hints the show has dropped about Shireen being... gaahhh, I can't even say it. Ah, SHIIIIIIIIT And I even forgot about the "You will betray the men serving you, you will betray your family, you will betray everything you once held dear... and it will all be worth it, because you are the Son of Fire, you are the Warrior of Light."-part (although I absolute love this scene!)... But well, D&D have a memory like a sieve, right? Any scene that happened two/three/four years ago doesn't have to mean anything, considering all the stuff they like to forget... does it?
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Post by Deleted on May 24, 2015 22:48:48 GMT
^ Me, too, forgot about the 'you will betray your family...' Cripes.
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Post by theonionsleight on May 24, 2015 22:53:36 GMT
^ Me, too, forgot about the 'you will betray your family...' Cripes. Well, "family" means not only Shireen, but also his wife; Selyse: "WE HAVE TO SACRIFICE OUR DAUGHTER!", Stannis: "What? Fucking NO, shut up, woman!" ~ The End ~ :/
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Post by theonionsleight on May 24, 2015 23:00:24 GMT
I could never-ever imagine him allowing this, especially not show!Stannis after 5x04, but also neither book!Stannis (uhm, and she isn't even with him in the books!)... but urgh, these Mel & Sel pics and this episode description... And this terrible Jon-dies-Stannis-dies-Mel-sacrifices-Shireen-Stannis-doesn't-come-back-but-Jon-suddenly-opens-his-eyes-theory some people have...
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