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Post by DaveyJoe on Sept 1, 2017 0:54:55 GMT
I think we've had seven years of evidence that these Lords are petty and struggle to put aside their personal feuds in the midst of greater threats. Many of them suffered under the Mad King. For better or worse, Jon's reluctance to kneel was an important plot point this year, and I expect some type of repercussion next year, otherwise it would have been a waste of time. They dragged out the Jon at Dragonstone story because of it, which ended up hurting the pacing for episode 6. If the Northern Lords are cool with it, that's more bad writing. I think you're kinda missing my point. I would want to see the Northern lords actually speak out about this. I think they should, since it obviously makes sense. But my point is that I don't think they will and I don't expect to see it, largely because the writers will think the audience won't care. It'd be just another loose end that they don't bother to tie up. I was thinking of including a disclaimer saying it all could be moot after season 7's writing. |
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Post by DaveyJoe on Sept 1, 2017 2:01:21 GMT
Lord Glover is the most flip-floppy character in the entire show. Says House Stark is dead and rejects their calls for help, two episodes later he's crying "King in the North!" Shocked/disgusted at the idea of training his grandaughter, two minutes later he's sold on the idea. Supports Jon, but two episodes after Jon leaves he says Sansa should be queen. He is only consistent in his inconsistencies. In a way Lord Glover is at Jon Snow levels of pragmatism with his characterization. In season 6, he's choosing not to get involved in Northern politics that will cause bloodshed for his people. Winter is coming and he needs to get his house ready for it. Even up until the day of the battle it seems like Jon is fighting a lost cause, and only wins thanks to Sansa's deus ex machina that nobody could have predicted. From his perspective, why should his house die alongside the Starks? Once the Starks win Lord Glover has the gift of hindsight to help him feel ashamed, along with a plucky 10 year old who has monopolized all of the fist pump writing over the past two years. As far as training women, it makes sense that these old heads would bristle at the idea in a patriarchal society. I don't think he suddenly thought it was brilliant as much as Lady Mormont's speech repeats the same beat from episode 6x10 and reminds Lord Glover of his shame for not fighting with the Starks last year. Again, Jon is the one saying they need to brace for Winter, but then he runs South to engage in politics. It makes sense that Lord Glover would be pissed that his King has abandoned his people as doom approaches. Even if it was the right call in the long run, Jon could have easily been killed, and his decision to go South was a huge political faux-pas in the context of his Northern duties. Some of the beats might have felt rushed, but I don't think Lord Glover ever acted unbelievable or overly inconsistent. Sometimes real people are inconsistent and dynamic as circumstances change. |
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Post by DaveyJoe on Sept 1, 2017 4:45:00 GMT
Peter said Tyrion has a lil crush on Dany, so maybe he does disapprove of the relationship too, though. Maybe it is love.  |
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Post by Basil on Sept 1, 2017 5:24:21 GMT
aww
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Post by stoneheartsrevenge on Sept 1, 2017 11:55:19 GMT
So do Jerome and Lena genuinely have a bad relationship? I thought it was just rumour and/or overblown but it's almost comical now how Bronn finds some reason to leave whenever Cersei is coming into very the scene  |
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Post by kingeomer on Sept 1, 2017 11:59:15 GMT
They were relying on the Sansa-Arya conflict from when they were younger to be enough of an explanation for Arya's behaviour. But they took it beyond the suspension of disbelief since Arya fails to use basic common sense. To be honest I've been kinda baffled by Arya's storyline since the end of S4. Or maybe more accurately, up until the point she killed Meryn. I think that was the point the showrunners decided they wanted her to be more of a killing machine so the audience could go "fuck yeah!". Every time she kills someone (Meryn, Walder, all the Freys) she either has a really smug face or walks out like a badass. I thought that the point of her leaving the Faceless Men was that she's not a killing machine, but two episodes later she's suddenly the greatest assassin (and apparently chef) in Westeros. Her scenes with Hot Pie, Nymeria, and even Ed Sheeran/Blackberry Wine Lannister were all about bringing back her humanity, but that's undone by her bizarre behaviour towards Sansa, including threatening to kill her ffs. So yeah, Arya's character arc is a total mystery to me I think when they decided that Arya should be the one to take out the Freys, they didn't really think through what this means for her character. Because killing your enemies is one thing, but baking them into pies and serving them to their father requires an obscene amount of sadism, it takes a really sick mind to come up with something like that. Did they not consider how this would affect Arya's characterisation? It's kind of ironic, the way they chose to portray the destruction of House Frey by Arya, as something super badass and awesome, totally undermines the point George was trying to make in the books by bringing Catelyn back to life and turning her into an inhuman spirit of vengeance. I don't think they could have missed the point of Lady Stoneheart harder if they had tried. So many good posts in this thread here, I don't even where to begin. Just know y'all are fabulous . I agree that with Arya taking over what I presume is the conclusion, or part of the conclusion of the Lady Stoneheart plot, the show missed the point by a wide margin...and making it a super badass moment versus "well I'm glad their dead BUT...." concerning moment does miss GRRM's point. Keep in mind BookEllaria who makes an argument against revenge, when presented with the Mountain's "head". Show Ellaria kills Myrcella, Doran, Trystane and Areo Hoteh all in her quest for revenge. Show completely misses the point and character. We never really talked about Tyrion's expression when Jon and Dany were bumping uglies. It could very well have been guilt. It felt kind of ominous and foreboding. Yeah, I'm not sure what that was all about. First I thought he was worried that them banging would complicate things, but if Jon and Dany were to marry, wouldn't that be ... a good thing? It would solidify their alliance and probably make it easier for the Northern lords ot accept a Southern queen. Perhaps it was jealousy.  I'm not sure what that was supposed to be about at all. Does he have a crush on her? Is he jealous? Is he worried that Jon will distract her from the ultimate prize? Is he feeling like Jon will replace him in her circle? It did feel foreboding and I've seen many speculate that Tyrion will betray her somehow and maybe even kill her. I don't see that happening unless she goes full Aerys and he has to make the same choice as Jaime does. I hate what they've done with the Northern Lords so much You know...the Northern storyline was my favorite in Dance with Dragons precisely because the Northern Lords stuck together, wanted justice for "the Ned", thought the Red Wedding was a horrible thing (i.e. Robb didn't deserve it), and thought "aw fuck no" when "Arya" was to be married to Ramsey. When you compare that to what we got on screen....it's disappointing. The Northern Lords are flakey and their allegiance changes with the weather. I get the fact that they are unhappy that their king went south again and has been absent for a while. But I guess it's in character with how they are presented with the show that they'd be ready to jump ship at a moment's notice. I agree with the bolded below, much of Jon's time in Dragonstone was his refusal to bend the knee out of the concerns for the North...and the show should spend time on this...given what the North has gone through over the years, they should be reluctant about the Dragon Queen and Jon bending the knee. But I don't think the show will spend much time on it with 6 episodes to go, at best we'll see Sansa vocalize some objections on how it was handled but with the Night's King and friends destroying the wall and marching South and the North ground zero for their wrath, they are going to have greater concerns then Jon bending the knee. You think they'd care with the army of the dead past the Wall? Or, more importantly, with only 6 episodes left?  I'm betting on Jon being dead by the end anyway. I think this is the most likely explanation. What's bizarre about it though is that he kinda helped them get together in the first place with his not-so-subtle "stares at you longingly" conversation. Same with Davos.
Davey I actually think you got a shout out on the other forum. There's a poster whose really sarcastic and someone said he reminded them of a certain raccoon. Well I don't have an account over there if anybody worries I'm over there trolling. |
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Post by kingeomer on Sept 1, 2017 12:00:24 GMT
So do Jerome and Lena genuinely have a bad relationship? I thought it was just rumour and/or overblown but it's almost comical now how Bronn finds some reason to leave whenever Cersei is coming into very the scene That seems to be what everyone is saying. They refuse to film together. I don't know what happened between them...but that's not good. |
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Post by TheMadQueen on Sept 1, 2017 13:19:04 GMT
So do Jerome and Lena genuinely have a bad relationship? I thought it was just rumour and/or overblown but it's almost comical now how Bronn finds some reason to leave whenever Cersei is coming into very the scene it must be legit, I mean, him leaving the Dragonpit to "go have a drink" didn't feel very natural. They did share a scene for about 0.05 seconds in season 3 when Cersei walks past him, but that's it. Lol I wonder what happened with them.... |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2017 14:42:28 GMT
GRRM still wears the same clothes lol I'm not sure what is more interesting, this episode or across board drama LOL SHOOK There were some things that were really great 10/10 * Tyrion and Cersei scene. These actors work really well together, i missed seeing them on screen together. This was probably the best scene in the episode. * Sansa finally orders the death of Littlefinger. I've known this was coming for years, and it was so great to see littlefinger brought low by the person he has manipulated for years. Littlefinger didn't know how to love, he wouldn't know a thing about it. I'm sorry but Aiden Gillan did not sell the character at all towards the later half of the series, i'm glad to see him go. Sophie's performance here was great, and Maisie was great too. *Jaime and Cersei's last conversation *Brienne and Jaime *Brienne and the Hound. When the Hound smiled at the thought of Arya being alive it melted my heart. * Dany talking about her family in the dragon pit * Cersei is SHOOK by the wight * Night King 'burns' wall * CLEGANEBOWL confirmed *Jon Snow's man buns *Cersei's twist. I liked this because i had started to worry they were making Cersei too reasonable. Some things i'm not 100% on *convenience. Everything was so convenient. Character meetings this season, who was allowed to die, travel buddies. In my opinion Tyrion would never have left that room alive, no way he would go alone. Cersei hates Tyrion with every ounce of her being, she unreasonably blames him for everything. *Arya and Sansa conflict - i enjoyed some aspects of it, but it stretched out far too long. Littlefinger could have been dealt with sooner *Bran. Wtf they handled him so well last season, now he is just there when it is convenient. Did harry Lloyd come back to play Rhaeger? LOL Anyway they should have made that a proper scene. We've been waiting for these revelations for years and they just flick through them quicker than an ice dragon can melt a wall. And the person he chooses to share this information is Sam? *Sam remembering some odd piece of information that GILLY SAID which he wasn't even paying attention to. I mean i know he is smart but still *Another one for Bran because he's spent months sitting in his seat, and he needed Sam to tell him about rhaeger? Isn't he all seeing. I mean why is he so slow. *Kit was especially poor this episode and i'm usually okay with him. His manbuns performed excellently though *Theon and the greyjoys. I just really have no investment into Euron or getting Yara back and my interest of Theon is waning. I just don't care anymore, the time for this has passed. (and i actually like the greyjoys and theon) *Since when do you need dragonglass to kill a wight? This was never established really...i mean to kill a white walker yes. But an ordinary sword works...or how did the men survive beyond the wall in E6 if they needed dragonglass to kill all those wights? |
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Post by DaveyJoe on Sept 1, 2017 14:51:31 GMT
I think the guys beyond the wall were using Dragonglass weapons made from what Jon had mined. Jorah had those shiny new daggers which killed the polar bear, and of course Beric and Thoros had their fire blades. They didn't actually say it, but the weapons they were carrying all looked new and coated in black.
Can anybody remember all the way back in season one when Jon fought the Wight, fire ultimately killed it, but did he try to stab it with a regular blade first? I can't recall.
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Post by Basil on Sept 1, 2017 14:53:10 GMT
Dany: I saw the Army of the Dead.
Jaime: How many?
Dany: Hundred thousand, at least.
Jaime: #shook
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Post by DaveyJoe on Sept 1, 2017 15:09:23 GMT
Dany: I saw the Army of the Dead. Jaime: How many? Dany: Hundred thousand, at least. Jaime: #shook Would be funny if Jaime abandons Cersei around the same time Tyrion does a betrayal for her. |
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Post by lordcarson on Sept 1, 2017 19:47:38 GMT
I think the guys beyond the wall were using Dragonglass weapons made from what Jon had mined. Jorah had those shiny new daggers which killed the polar bear, and of course Beric and Thoros had their fire blades. They didn't actually say it, but the weapons they were carrying all looked new and coated in black. Can anybody remember all the way back in season one when Jon fought the Wight, fire ultimately killed it, but did he try to stab it with a regular blade first? I can't recall. tormund's new axe is dragonglass jon used a regular sword because he didn't longclaw yet. he stabbed the dude in the leg several times and then cut his arm off and put it through him |
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Post by Father of Dragons on Sept 1, 2017 20:04:58 GMT
Somebody voted after I went to all the effort of finding the average. Fess up! Who clearly doesn't appreciate my effort??  |
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Post by Father of Dragons on Sept 1, 2017 20:12:28 GMT
Also  |
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Post by DaveyJoe on Sept 1, 2017 21:47:27 GMT
Also Why is that a raven? Petyr's sigil is a mockingbird. SMH |
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Post by TheMadQueen on Sept 1, 2017 22:31:40 GMT
don't like it lol
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Post by stoneheartsrevenge on Sept 1, 2017 23:23:09 GMT
I think the guys beyond the wall were using Dragonglass weapons made from what Jon had mined. Jorah had those shiny new daggers which killed the polar bear, and of course Beric and Thoros had their fire blades. They didn't actually say it, but the weapons they were carrying all looked new and coated in black. Can anybody remember all the way back in season one when Jon fought the Wight, fire ultimately killed it, but did he try to stab it with a regular blade first? I can't recall. Gendry' sis the only one that obviously wasn't Dragonglass. Jorah quite clearly had two dragonglass daggers, didn't pay attention to the rest. Also, Fire didn't stop the bear Wight, for some reason. Somebody voted after I went to all the effort of finding the average. Fess up! Who clearly doesn't appreciate my effort?? In fairness, Bec did mention that she wouldn't be able to watch the episode until 'next week' so yi'm afraid it's you who was too presumptuous, young paddawan...  Also Meh. I usually like these but...meh |
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Post by Father of Dragons on Sept 1, 2017 23:29:11 GMT
Why is that a raven? Petyr's sigil is a mockingbird. SMH It's not a raven. Ravens are all black. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2017 0:37:35 GMT
Somebody voted after I went to all the effort of finding the average. Fess up! Who clearly doesn't appreciate my effort?? obviously me hun DaveyJoe in season one they used fire mainly. When Jon stabbed the wight it didn't die, i think ghost helped and then the fire happened. Maybe i've just forgotten. If they had dragonglass weapons, they didn't really look it so i didn't notice |
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