6x04 POST-Episode Discussion (airs 15th May)

I don't know, I'm not the writer.  George is.  I think George's strength as a writer will prove that he not resort to using the dragons as a get-out-of-jail card, and instead will create tension while building the strength of Dany as a character when it's most crucial. Dany's just been pulled out of her comfort zone as a queen, and is facing a culture she was once respected in, but now views her as a 'respected' relic, as long as she falls in line. This has too much potential for conflict for George to set up and blow away in one chapter.  That's not his style.

If George didn't want to play with this tension, I think the show could have had Dany destroying her enemies in the premier.  But it makes sense from a storytelling perspective.

A good cliffhanger subverts your expectations. 

I guess we'll see, nice discussion, guys.



Dying is something that's characteristic of everybody on a long enough time line. For example: I was walking to my local bank last week, and I stumbled off the curb and got hit by a bus. While I was waiting in purgatory, I wrote a strongly worded e-mail to Mothra, whom I pledged my allegiance to, and was like 'WTF? You didn't script me for this!' Mothra screeched and flew away to wage battle with Godzilla, so I guess that pretty much settles that.

But overall, I agree.  That shit was uncharacteristic.  It was also uncharacteristic for Robb to be betrayed by Roose Bolton, he never made a habit of that shit.  And for Jon Snow to be stabbed by his brothers, five books and all of a sudden that just happens??  Tywin Lannister lived like 60 years without being murdered by his son in the privy, until it's convenient for the story.  Tsk tsk.

Who cares, really?

But my Finnish subtitles called him Aggo, so I guess that's what his name is.

You know George always brings up that to make it real it has to be bittersweet ... man when  you have more bitter than sweet it's just bitter.

I disagree with that. Dany still struggled with the same thing she did in the book on the show. Trying to be someone her people wanted her to be or to be who she truly is. We saw Dany disheveled next to Drogon and on the journey to Vaes Dothrak. But we didn't see her break down. The vision quest would have been an amazing way for the audience to understand her struggle, and the clarity that comes afterwards will inform nearly every decision she makes after that.

I believe in the book Drogon next to her will ensure she comes to no harm with the Khals there. And like Nictarion says, she does believe the words Quaithe told her. So she will want to go back to Vaes Dothrak, to rule over the Dothraki. I think after that it will play out most of the same way. Plus the Dothraki i think will make it back to Mereen in time to help with the battle so i believe she won't be with the Dothraki for too long.

i didn't even notice that i corrected you to be honest

It's not about Dany's mindset, it's about how the structure of the show differs from the book. One of the first things I learned in my screenwriting courses was that every scene you write should develop the characters while also advancing the plot. Writing a scene that does only one of those should be done extremely sparingly. The book has the advantage of being able to get into the character's minds and has a lot more time(pages) to elaborate on their thoughts. The show has limited time to work with, so early on, back in the first season, the show set a realistic tone where every scene would be set in reality, and in the present. With the massive task of streamlining such an epic story and juggling so many characters, the show has to choose its character moments very carefully, and a season finale is not a good place for such a scene.

We've never had a hallucination scene in the show, because it would slow things down. The story needs to keep moving forward, especially Dany's story, which has been slugging along in Meereen since season 4.  'Promise me' happened back in the first book, but the show didn't have time for it in season one, so it saved it until Jon's parentage was relevant to the story at hand. Oberyn didn't tell Tyrion about his trip to Casterly Rock until he vowed to be his champion, so it moved the story forward as well. The show has to make sacrifices like this to keep the audience invested. It would have taken up precious minutes in the finale to just establish that Dany's in a bad place mentally, it wouldn't have served the story. It might have confused the audience, and it definitely would have slowed the pace of the season finale, which is an episode that needs to offer resolution and establish next year's story.

But you're making the assumption that her hallucinations don't advance the plot. They do...i mean if they didn't want to explore Dany's mindset they wouldn't have her fly away from her city, abandon her friends in the first place. For Dany to get to where she is now(i.e burning down the temple and ruling over the dothraki), she had to get through something- come to some sort of realisation.

Her reasons for burning down the temple are not explored much on the show, and come across as more of a practical reason rather than embracing her fire and blood side fully. So i can't say the hallucinations wouldn't have worked. I guess that's a matter of opinion, but we'll never know because they didn't do it. I think it was more a question of time and logistics more than anything else. They wanted to leave her with the cliffhanger for obvious reasons at the end of season 5 and didn't have time for it in the finale.