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Post by DaveyJoe on Apr 30, 2017 20:53:03 GMT
Well, Orange is the New Black takes place in a low security prison, and the majority of inmates are not violent criminals, so it makes sense that there is not a whole lot of violence going on. I love it, it's one of my favourite shows that's currently on. The cast of characters is so large and diverse, and both the writing and acting are absolutely amazing. I also think that compelling drama can be created without killing off characters in every episode. Mad Men was one of my favorite shows, and there is no violence in it. It's just the prison culture in the US is extremely toxic and Orange is the New Black feels more like fantasy to me. I have friends that were incarcerated in mininum security prisons and there was almost always a threat of violence. My friend almost got his ass beat over a Snickers bar, and he's a big guy, somebody not many would threaten. But of course female prisons are probably different. The show is really good in the drama department. I love the Laverne Cox storyline. I just feel like the prison industrial complex is one of the most damaging aspects of America and this show doesn't do enough to demonize it. There's too much ratcheting of tension without enough catharsis. But my opinion doez't mean much. It is very well acted for sure. |
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Post by stoneheartsrevenge on Apr 30, 2017 20:55:04 GMT
Well, Orange is the New Black takes place in a low security prison, and the majority of inmates are not violent criminals, so it makes sense that there is not a whole lot of violence going on. I love it, it's one of my favourite shows that's currently on. The cast of characters is so large and diverse, and both the writing and acting are absolutely amazing. I also think that compelling drama can be created without killing off characters in every episode. Agreed. Drama doesn't need violence, and I appreciate the show for delving into the psyche of these women. Constant violence doesn't really make sense in the context of this show because the majority are non-violent criminals. Season 2, with the conflict between Vee and Red, changes the dynamic slightly, but even there it's clear that the women Vee 'recruits' aren't particularly violent people. Yes there are violent episodes but they are the natural culmination of a storyline that has built tensions and pressures between the inmates. Season 3 to some extent, but season 4 in particular, really ramp up the tensions of the prison. It's not spoiling much to say that Litchfield becomes privatised, leading to massive overcrowding and gradually worsening conditions. This serves as the narrative drive that has some pretty big pay-offs, imo. The whole dynamic in Litchfield is changed in season 4 The show also has some gut-wrenching moments. A few just off the top of my head: Trish's suicide in S1; Morello's delusions about her "fiancé" and breaking into his house, laying in the bathtub sobbing in S2; eveything Suzanne; Nicky being carted off to solitary because of the drugs (I was so glad we got her back); the transphobic attack on Sophia and resulting despicable treatment by the prison; and of course, Poussey's death. Fuck, I still get emotional thinking about it now. Iirc there was an incident very similar in the U.S shortly before the season aired actually, where a man was killed by a police officer in a similar fashion. Which made the season even more relevant. |
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Post by stoneheartsrevenge on Apr 30, 2017 21:00:20 GMT
Well, Orange is the New Black takes place in a low security prison, and the majority of inmates are not violent criminals, so it makes sense that there is not a whole lot of violence going on. I love it, it's one of my favourite shows that's currently on. The cast of characters is so large and diverse, and both the writing and acting are absolutely amazing. I also think that compelling drama can be created without killing off characters in every episode. Mad Men was one of my favorite shows, and there is no violence in it. It's just the prison culture in the US is extremely toxic and Orange is the New Black feels more like fantasy to me. I have friends that were incarcerated in mininum security prisons and there was almost always a threat of violence. My friend almost got his ass beat over a Snickers bar, and he's a big guy, somebody not many would threaten. But of course female prisons are probably different. The show is really good in the drama department. I love the Laverne Cox storyline. I just feel like the prison industrial complex is one of the most damaging aspects of America and this show doesn't do enough to demonize it. There's too much ratcheting of tension without enough catharsis. But my opinion doez't mean much. It is very well acted for sure. The dynamic within the prison does change actually. Especially in season 4. And both season 3 and 4 do a lot to demonise the prison system. Your story about the snickers bar reminded me of Season 1 when Piper first arrives and Taystee starts fighting with Flaca because "IT WAS A KING CONE!"  I guess it's also important to remember this is a dramedy too. edit: oh shit I miss Claudette  That was my favourite story in season 1 |
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Post by DaveyJoe on Apr 30, 2017 21:05:55 GMT
Well, Orange is the New Black takes place in a low security prison, and the majority of inmates are not violent criminals, so it makes sense that there is not a whole lot of violence going on. I love it, it's one of my favourite shows that's currently on. The cast of characters is so large and diverse, and both the writing and acting are absolutely amazing. I also think that compelling drama can be created without killing off characters in every episode. Agreed. Drama doesn't need violence, and I appreciate the show for delving into the psyche of these women. Constant violence doesn't really make sense in the context of this show because the majority are non-violent criminals. Season 2, with the conflict between Vee and Red, changes the dynamic slightly, but even there it's clear that the women Vee 'recruits' aren't particularly violent people. Yes there are violent episodes but they are the natural culmination of a storyline that has built tensions and pressures between the inmates. Season 3 to some extent, but season 4 in particular, really ramp up the tensions of the prison. It's not spoiling much to say that Litchfield becomes privatised, leading to massive overcrowding and gradually worsening conditions. This serves as the narrative drive that has some pretty big pay-offs, imo. The whole dynamic in Litchfield is changed in season 4 The show also has some gut-wrenching moments. A few just off the top of my head: Trish's suicide in S1; Morello's delusions about her "fiancé" and breaking into his house, laying in the bathtub sobbing in S2; eveything Suzanne; Nicky being carted off to solitary because of the drugs (I was so glad we got her back); the transphobic attack on Sophia and resulting despicable treatment by the prison; and of course, Poussey's death. Fuck, I still get emotional thinking about it now. Iirc there was an incident very similar in the U.S shortly before the season aired actually, where a man was killed by a police officer in a similar fashion. Which made the season even more relevant. But non-violent offenders typically have to adapt to the power dynamic of prisons where violence is the most accessible form of currency. It is the norm from my understanding of prisons in America. I'm conflicted, because the show is very well made. But it's like if they made a comedy about the drug war. I know it's an irrational reason to dislike a show, but I''m weird. |
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Post by day dreamer on May 3, 2017 13:16:47 GMT
I'm now reading the spoilers online...this seems weird, but very incomplete.
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Post by stoneheartsrevenge on May 9, 2017 19:37:59 GMT
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Post by stoneheartsrevenge on Jun 10, 2017 19:10:51 GMT
I am...not a fan, so far. The subject matter they are exploring this season is really at odds with the light-hearted tone. That has been true in past seasons but it really isn't working this time. Just finished "Litchfield's Got Talent" and whoever came up with that episode deserves to be fired, utterly absurd and is just way too at odds with the riot situation. And Angie having the gun now and using that purely for comedic effect was an awful choice. The only good plot part of this episode was the flashback stuff.
From a purely horny POV though, I appreciated the stripping scene.... |
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Post by Basil on Jun 12, 2017 18:50:24 GMT
I'm shipping the two handsome guards hard. That one scene in episode four, oh my.
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Post by Basil on Jun 12, 2017 22:46:41 GMT
It's a weird fucking season. I don't think I like it. I still enjoy the character interactions for the most part, but they are spending way, waaaaaaay too much time on shitty, unlikeable, minor characters. I just finished episode 6 and most of my favourite characters, like Red, Nicky, Lorna, Sophia, have barely had any screentime so far, maybe ten minutes in total. Whereas it feels like every other scene features the meth heads and the fucking neo nazis, who I'm not invested in at all and also kind of hate. Like seriously, what the fuck is up with that? The comedic nature of this show don't fit the theme of this season at all. I'm not sure if it is meant to be funny or disturbing, it doesn't really work either way. Especially the stuff with the hostages. If this was real life, this whole situation would be terrifying, but in this show, it's played for laughs, it's all just silliness ... which is just so weird. I wish they would go back to normal prison life, that's infinitely more compelling to me than the crazy shit they've been doing all this fucking mess of a season. It's a bummer, I was really looking forward to it. There's still some genuienly good stuff in it. As I said, I still love a lot of the characters and I think all the flashbacks so far have been great, especially the one with teenage Watson (that Dreamgirls scene was powerful). But the actual storyline is a sad fucking mess at this point ... and I have no idea how the show is supposed to recover from this. |
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Post by stoneheartsrevenge on Jun 13, 2017 0:36:54 GMT
It's a weird fucking season. I don't think I like it. I still enjoy the character interactions for the most part, but they are spending way, waaaaaaay too much time on shitty, unlikeable, minor characters. I just finished episode 6 and most of my favourite characters, like Red, Nicky, Lorna, Sophia, have barely had any screentime so far, maybe ten minutes in total. Whereas it feels like every other scene features the meth heads and the fucking neo nazis, who I'm not invested in at all and also kind of hate. Like seriously, what the fuck is up with that? The comedic nature of this show don't fit the theme of this season at all. I'm not sure if it is meant to be funny or disturbing, it doesn't really work either way. Especially the stuff with the hostages. If this was real life, this whole situation would be terrifying, but in this show, it's played for laughs, it's all just silliness ... which is just so weird. I wish they would go back to normal prison life, that's infinitely more compelling to me than the crazy shit they've been doing all this fucking mess of a season. It's a bummer, I was really looking forward to it. There's still some genuienly good stuff in it. As I said, I still love a lot of the characters and I think all the flashbacks so far have been great, especially the one with teenage Watson (that Dreamgirls scene was powerful). But the actual storyline is a sad fucking mess at this point ... and I have no idea how the show is supposed to recover from this. My thoughts exactly. I think the back end of the season improves as we focus again on characters we actually care about more, and the negotiations become more compelling. But tonally the season is all wrong for the subject matter. It kind of works as outrageous dark humour in a day-to-day prison life situation but not a high stakes riot As you said too, the cast is too large now and spends too much time with characters I despise and not in a love-to-hate way. I mean they totally removed characters like Sophia and Sister Ingalls at the start of the season, and as you said Red's family gets so little screentime in the first half of the season. Boo was also a big miss, she had such a reduced role. It says a lot that I can't name any of the Neo-Nazis or other weird grunts they introduced. Won't go into specifics but the over-sized cast will possibly change next season...the finale ends in a weird place so I'm not sure where they'll take it from there. The flashbacks we got were good but there weren't nearly enough. I think Daya's is the last one, whereas usually it's one per episode. I missed that. There were still some good moments, and the latter half of the season was a lot better than the first half. Spoilers for the end of the season In no particular order, some comments: Fig coming back as the negotiator was brilliant. They should keep her in every season because she's fucking awesome. Gloria's storyline was heartbreaking. I was rooting for her to see her son but fuck. I hope she survives. Daya's painting was a cool Easter egg - it was Bennet. I didn't realise until she mentioned the leg. Lorna actually being pregnant was kinda predictable imo. Boy who cried wolf and all. Piper is such an incredibly irritating person (but not in the way the meth heads and neo-Nazis are). But I kind of like the idea of her and Alex marrying. It would never last, but nice idea. Piscatella dying at the end seems...I dunno. A too quick solution to a complex problem. The riot squad can't count. They say 10 inmates are missing. Their count includes MCC lady so that brings count to 11 missing. There are actually 12: Red, Flores, Frieda, Cindy, Taystee, Suzanne, Alex, Nicky, Piper, Gloria are all in the pool. Tucky is out with Donuts  (Such a gross dynamic btw) and Chang ran off through the fence. Another cliffhanger ending. That's annoying. I can't see them killing off any of these characters tbh so it all feels a bit of a cop out. No idea what happens next season now that everyone is transferred. They will either bring it back on track and slim down the cast, or lose it all together by spreading the existing cast across two prisons and adding more faceless side characters |
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Post by Basil on Jun 14, 2017 0:04:38 GMT
I just finished Episode 10. That was some heavy shit, man. But I'm glad that the season really does get better as it goes on, the first five episodes were a chore, but I'm into it now. It's way past midnight, but I don't think I'll be able to fall asleep before I binge the rest of it. Shit.
I can't stand the two meth head girls. They can be moderately amusing in small doses, but I've seen more than enough of them this season, they are so fucking irritating.
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Post by Basil on Jun 14, 2017 11:13:52 GMT
I'm conflicted. I think the first half of the season was an awful mess and I really didn't like it. But the second half was incredible and it had some of the strongest moments in the entire show. The finale especially was great, the last scene gave me massive chills, and the music, it was very powerful. I'm not even angry that it ended on a cliffhanger, because it was so well done and emotional. I doubt they'll kill anyone though, this show has a tendency to give rather underwhelming resolutions to its cliffhangers, so I'm not too concerend that one of my favourites might bite it.
So much awesome stuff in the final few episodes, Bailey apologizing to Poussey's dad, Lorna and Vinnie, which was super cute. Flaritza <3. I love the dynamic between Figueroa and Caputo. Glad Piscatella was killed, to be honest.
Not sure where the show will go from here, but I do hope they bring all the prisoners back together, cuz I really don't want a new prison or a bunch of faceless new characters. It even made me like Piper again a little bit. |
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Post by day dreamer on Jun 23, 2017 1:51:35 GMT
I just finished the season and I kind of hated it. It became very unrealistic to me that the stand off went so long.
I find Pennsitucky hooking up with her rapist so incredibly offensive then they go and pull that shit with Piscatella torturing Red? His flashback felt so incomplete too and it can't finish because he's dead.
I did like a few things
*Danielle Brooks needs and Emmy nom for her work this season. Taystee was the MVP
*Gloria's story was heartbreaking
*I loved the library tribute to Poussey, but Soso waa criminally underused.
*Janae's flashback
*Cindy saying "karma!" And dumping the dead CO out of his wheelchair made me LOL
*Daya taking responsibility and calling Pornstache's mom to take her daughter.
What a mess.
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Post by stoneheartsrevenge on Jun 23, 2017 10:40:13 GMT
I just finished the season and I kind of hated it. It became very unrealistic to me that the stand off went so long. I find Pennsitucky hooking up with her rapist so incredibly offensive then they go and pull that shit with Piscatella torturing Red? His flashback felt so incomplete too and it can't finish because he's dead. I did like a few things *Danielle Brooks needs and Emmy nom for her work this season. Taystee was the MVP *Gloria's story was heartbreaking *I loved the library tribute to Poussey, but Soso waa criminally underused. *Janae's flashback *Cindy saying "karma!" And dumping the dead CO out of his wheelchair made me LOL *Daya taking responsibility and calling Pornstache's mom to take her daughter. What a mess. The Pennsatucky stuff was fucking gross. I agree with the rest of your points, although I found the torture episode difficult but kind of believeable given Piscatella's character. He already tortured Red last season (sleep deprivation). This was escalation. Danielle Brooks really was fantastic. Shame she needs to wait until next year for the award |
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Post by day dreamer on Jun 23, 2017 13:15:33 GMT
I just don't know wtf they were thinking with Penn and her rapist. I feel like they don't even realize that it IS gross and no one actively wants it to happen.
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Post by day dreamer on Jun 23, 2017 17:34:50 GMT
Also, I can't help but be really annoyed at how badly Maria screwed Gloria over. They could've worked together.
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Post by kingeomer on Jul 9, 2017 13:00:48 GMT
I am...not a fan, so far. The subject matter they are exploring this season is really at odds with the light-hearted tone. That has been true in past seasons but it really isn't working this time. Just finished "Litchfield's Got Talent" and whoever came up with that episode deserves to be fired, utterly absurd and is just way too at odds with the riot situation. And Angie having the gun now and using that purely for comedic effect was an awful choice. The only good plot part of this episode was the flashback stuff.
From a purely horny POV though, I appreciated the stripping scene.... A month later, I am catching up on this one. I just finished Litchfield's Got Talent and I think it's the worst episode they've ever done. The Talent show was ridiculous (the guards being upset about losing, wtf?). How in the world is Linda fooling the other prisoners? Does anyone remember why Allison is in jail, she seems the most normal of them all? I thought her flashback would illuminate that, but it didn't. And yes, the flashback was the best part of the episode. I thought it was sad that Sophia goes to Max to find Sister only to find out she had gotten Compassionate Release. I figure they had to make that move to get Sophia off the canvas while Laverne Cox filmed the TV show Doubt (which has been cancelled). And those prisoners are stupid for targeting Judy King, when she could have been instrumental in getting their demands heard and being a voice between them and the outside world. The seance scene with the girls trying contact Poussey could have been touching and perhaps healing for Soso, Suzanne and Taystee but it instead de-evolves into who knew Poussey best between Soso and Taystee. I am glad to hear that the season gets better as it goes on. |
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Post by kingeomer on Jul 29, 2017 14:34:33 GMT
I'm done with this season.
It did get better as it went on but I agree with the sentiments on here: the tone of the show did not fit with the subject matter. At times I felt like Taystee, Fig, & Caputo were on a different show.
Dannielle Brooks deserves an Emmy nod. I know they usually submit under comedy which tanks her chances...if they submit under drama next season, she should be a best actress nod. She was riveting. Even when I was like Taystee, YOU KNOW BETTER, when she tanked the deal because they had not even done the investigation into Bailey (and how could they have? It had only been a few days since Poussey's death and no way could an investigation or interview of prisoners have happened with a riot going on) and she wanted Bailey charged. I felt like Poussey would have been honored to have all those reforms going into Litchfield.
Piscatella's death was stupid (I absolutely hated the horror show element with him and Red). Husband said SWAT teams are trained to avoid the very thing that happened with Piscatella and in no way would (or should they) be treating prisoners that way. I think it would have been better to have Piscatella alive to deal with the fall out of that video.
Penns and Donuts was just gross. Glad Boo figured out Linda. I do hope the gang gets back together, I have no interest in following the girls in different prisons. I felt terrible for Gloria and Maria did totally screw her over.
I HATE ANGIE AND LEANNE WITH THE FIRE OF 10,000 SUNS. Do you think Daya gets tried for murder now that Humps is dead? Does it matter that Angie and Leanne burned all the files?
Acting MVPS this season: Gloria and Dannielle Brooks
Forgot: Uzo Aduba is always good as Suzanne.
I think Flaca and Maritiza are charming and funny. I crack up whenever they are on screen. Soso was totally underused. Same with Sophia (though I know Laverne Cox was off filming Doubt).
Let's hope next season is over all better.
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Post by day dreamer on Jul 31, 2017 4:15:03 GMT
^ I agree with every single thing you wrote there.
Leanne and Angie got way too much screen time this season.
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Post by stoneheartsrevenge on Jul 31, 2017 17:41:51 GMT
^ I agree with every single thing you wrote there. Leanne and Angie got way too much screen time this season. As did the nameless nazis. (Seriously,cant even remember their names they are so bland) |
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That was my favourite story in season 1
(Such a gross dynamic btw) and Chang ran off through the fence.