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Post by Mecha-StannisForever on May 24, 2019 11:42:19 GMT
I mean, I'm certainly shaking my head at that statement. He should have known better. It's common sense really. Sansa's sudden love for northen independance is enough to justify a conflict between her and Dany, saying Dany's looks are also a factor is just sexist. I honestly love the complete failure of the idea of this Northern independence nonsense. I mean Tyrion gives a rousing speech going on about "what unites us", and one of the big themes of the story was about all these people from different backgrounds, cultures and parts of the world, coming together to fight the WW, and while it didn't work out ideally, they're at least left with an understanding that it can work out, with time. That commoners can be as component as high lords, that "savages" like the Wildlings and the Dothraki aren't all evil monsters, and so on... Unless you're from the north, in which case fuck that noise. You don't need no King telling you what to do. You're a Kween! It's just such a weird conflicted message. Again, what have the Northerners had so much worse than anyone else that they get independence? Why did Yara forget that she herself asked Dany for independence like 2 seasons ago? It was the sole reason she supported her. Why don't the Vale, or the Riverlands, or Dorne want independence? Northern Independence is such a weird concept, and I am 100% certain as with many things (like Lord Bronn of High Garden) this will not happen in the books. If anything, Sansa is responsible for Dany spiralling into "madness". I don't get how that something we're supposed to applaud, especially since that kind of scheming from people like Littlefinger and Cersei was considered to be the thing that helped start all these pointless wars in the first place.
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Post by Deleted on May 24, 2019 13:14:37 GMT
So i don't know what to say about thos episode. I actually enjoyed the atmosphete of the first half and then hated the ending.
The characters talk about breaking the wheel but the reality is it would take a great evil act like the night king or Dany to actually do that. All they achieved in Westeros was start the wheel again. Leaders are chosen from the top 1% and the small council is composed of tyrion and his mates talking shit again. Oh look there is a woman there now.i just hated chosing bran as king because of things already mentioned. He doesnt deserve the title, could be the most selfish character and has the personality of a cucumber.
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Post by Basil on May 24, 2019 13:34:58 GMT
what makes me sad is that I actually used to really like Bran as a character ... before they turned him into a robot
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Post by Singer of Death on May 24, 2019 14:00:07 GMT
Robot Bran has potential to pay off something. It’s an interesting outcome when he inherit the power of the 3ER.
But it’s a shame they didn’t utilize him much throughout the series. Otherwise it would make King Bran slightly understandable. Just slightly.
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Post by stoneheartsrevenge on May 24, 2019 21:40:28 GMT
what makes me sad is that I actually used to really like Bran as a character ... before they turned him into a robot Book Bran is my top 3 with Dany and Cat. The show has now fucked over all three of my faves
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Post by Singer of Death on May 24, 2019 21:56:23 GMT
I’m glad Theon is the only favourite character of mine that wasn’t screwed over by D&D.
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Post by Deleted on May 24, 2019 22:25:05 GMT
Also what i don't get is the North becoming independent. Sansa thinks she is top shit now and just couldn't stand the fact that people wanted Bran king? I kind of agree with her, but wanting to be independent from your brother? what is the point. I don't buy the other kingdoms being okay with it. What does the north achieve by being independent? I guess they dont pay taxes to the crown? They just don't want to be ruled by a southerner? Well hang on, bran is not a southerner. Or is it just because Sansa had to be queen? I would have rathered her be queen of the seven kingdoms, and bran lord of winterfell. That would be real progress. I think she was insulted no one thought of her, but i guess no one wants someone trained by cersei and littlefinger. Bran does a total 180 and accepts being King despite the fact he didn't want to be lord of winterfell. So his line "why do you think im here? " means that he knew about this moment. So he let jon and dany go south knowing she would massacre a city. WTF?!?
Dany's last moments with jon were well acted, and drogons grief was one of the best scenes. Nothing made me cry though, i didn't get sad or happy by the endings and for me that shows a failure of the show to deliver good writing that would actually elicit an emotion. And i can cry easily lol
I thought most character endings were great - hated bronn, seriously why is he still on this show - loved brienne - loved sam although i thought it would be him who wrote the book - arya seemed happy but should have been with gendry - loved seeing the other lords, hated edmure being shut down (maybe he has changed seeing his family die and his home invaded?!) - disliked Jons ending. Why the fuck is there a nights watch. Breaking the wheel means that bastards abd broken things are accepted rather than ostrisized. I liked his reunion with ghost and tormund, but what exactly is their plan for survival in the north, will the ice melt awbd become green again? I thought i saw a hint of that. Jons story came full circle so it didnt feel like growth. It just felt like fake happiness for him to go off on his own without family.
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Post by Father of Dragons on May 24, 2019 22:43:14 GMT
It's a shame, but Bran's storyline has suffered for a long time. Aside from the obvious absense in S5, it also got very little explanation of ... well anything really. The Reeds are the best example - they pretty much just show up, say "we've come a long way to find you", talk a bit about having visions, and that's basically all the characterisation they get. That's not helped by the ending Meera got - I was hoping she'd show up at some point in S8 but I guess the writers kinda forgot?
And that lack of explanation for his story is at its worst in S8. When a good chunk of the audience thinks he's purposefully hiding information but the ending implies he's actually supposed to be a good guy, the writing's fucked.
Random thought: since the Night's Watch is still a thing, does that make Jon the 1000th Lord Commander? The decision to start the series only a few away from 1000 was obviously intentional, so I guess it's kinda fitting that the White Walkers are no longer a threat; it's like a new age for the Night's Watch (although the fact that the Night's Watch is still a thing is obviously another element that could do with more explanation - deserving of more than a throwaway line).
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Post by stoneheartsrevenge on May 24, 2019 23:32:08 GMT
Enid Belle Dany be looking over the ashes of KL like Edit; omg that freezeframe! I’ve never noticed the cring away because she just exposed herself to them all before
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Post by Singer of Death on May 25, 2019 0:25:17 GMT
Jon’s ending is basically him being free from the politics and corruption of the seven kingdoms. He was sent to the Wall as a punishment for what he did, and everyone knows that the NW becomes a hollow institution that no longer hold its original purpose.
My real complaints is that his heritage as a Targ serves no purpose (even as Rhaegar’s legitimate son) whatsoever, but for his character it’s probably the best ending.
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Post by Enid on May 25, 2019 8:26:58 GMT
Enid Belle Dany be looking over the ashes of KL like Edit; omg that freezeframe! I’ve never noticed the cring away because she just exposed herself to them all before Love it. Also I just realized that the fire in Rebecca's home had more foreshadowing than Dany burning KL. I'm glad I live in a wold in which Crazy Ex-Girlfriend exists
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Post by DaveyJoe on May 25, 2019 9:01:28 GMT
It is insulting how bad the writing is in season 8. You can go not only from episode to episode but from scene to scene to find plot holes, inconsistencies, and botched character developments. The writing is so bad that people who have never thought critically about a show before see going 'wait... Something's wrong.'
I defended all sorts of stuff from the writers over the years. This is not an easy series to adapt, but season 8 was literally insulting to my intelligence. 'I can't be the Lord of Winterfell' to 'Why do you think I came all this way?' 'We wouldn't have survived without her' to 'I don't need many allies.'. 'What we're seeing is the end of the Dothraki' to 'Olulululuolulolulolu.'
I mean, these guys thought we'd take any happy bullshit and clap our hands like we weren't well invested in what was one of the greatest shows ever made. 'Dany is quite pretty and that must have factored into Sansa's decision...' Fuck you. You should know better. How did you guys devolve so drastically? Watch any episode from season 4 and then fire something up from the absolute fucking Trainwreck that is season 8, the difference in quality is clear as day.
These fucking guys got drunk and spent a weekend on the first draft of a screenplay that went straight to air, without a single thought that fans would be smart enough to catch every plot hole and character inconsistency because these guys thought they were the smartest writers in the world to find the success they did. Everytime a Targaryan is born, the writers flip a coin and fuck over an entire fanbase. Dave and Dan: suck my dick
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Post by DaveyJoe on May 25, 2019 9:03:29 GMT
I'm sorry, that was not... Kingly.
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Post by Basil on May 25, 2019 10:29:42 GMT
I'm glad the show is over ... but secretly, I kind of want this, not gonna lie. Season 9:
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Post by stoneheartsrevenge on May 25, 2019 11:55:56 GMT
I find it hilarious that one of the defences of the terrible writing this season i’ve encountered is “these problems always existed.” Lol, i know sweet cheeks, and complained about them at the time and was dismissed as a whiny hater.
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Post by kingeomer on May 25, 2019 12:49:29 GMT
I’m glad Theon is the only favourite character of mine that wasn’t screwed over by D&D. Alfie Allen is probably glad too! I am glad as well. I'm glad the show is over ... but secretly, I kind of want this, not gonna lie. Season 9: That would have been a good scene to end on. I find it hilarious that one of the defences of the terrible writing this season i’ve encountered is “these problems always existed.” Lol, i know sweet cheeks, and complained about them at the time and was dismissed as a whiny hater. Yeah, these problems have existed for a long time which is why no one should be surprised that they shit the bed on season 8. Saying that the writing has not been stellar since season 5 was not what most of the fanbase was willing to hear at the time. All the awards love the show has gotten since season 5 has only reinforced their worst instincts. Re: Northern Independence, in this new world that the show envisioned it doesn't make sense. But if they had Sansa say something like this to Bran: our mother and brother died for an independent north, our people will only accept that. Northerners do not do well in the south-you know what happened to our grandfather, uncle, aunt, father, mother and brother. At least reminding the audience of the history would have it make a little more sense. And the North has not been the only kingdom screwed over, so why didn't the others ask? Also wouldn't it have made sense to have the rest of them scared by Jon's Targ bloodline for fear that he too would go nuts? That would make his Northern exile believable. This show sacrificed background plotting for the element of surprise.
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Post by Enid on May 25, 2019 13:09:09 GMT
Everyone worrying about Dany becoming crazy while not considering the same could happen to Jon and presenting Dany's infertility as a problem but saying Bran's won't be is pure sexism as far as I'm concerned.
I would like to think it was intentional, to showcase how sexist Westeros is, but after the ending and the writers comments about the Dany/Sansa feud my belief is that they didn't realize they were being sexist.
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Post by Deleted on May 25, 2019 14:09:00 GMT
I think Dany's madness and her dictactorial pursuits were a more pressing issue than her procreating. But i agree there's an undertone of sexism.
I can't help but say Dany was kind of right? I mean Sansa was never going to be loyal and the starks just seemed to serve their own purposes selfishly. Naming Bran king is redundant, its tyrion who truly rules. I don't think Dany's intention was to kill everyone in the world. The way her lines were said kind've had traces of regret and remorse but too blinded by rage for Cersei and that is why she burnt kings landing
I don't know. I'm conflicted
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Post by TheMadQueen on May 25, 2019 14:28:47 GMT
I'm glad the show is over ... but secretly, I kind of want this, not gonna lie. Season 9: is it bad that I kind of am convincing myself this happened?
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Post by Singer of Death on May 25, 2019 15:02:34 GMT
I'm glad the show is over ... but secretly, I kind of want this, not gonna lie. Season 9: Interestingly, D&D said at one point that the albums created for GoT on Spotify hinted the ending for season 8. Some of them are obvious (like Jon killing Dany), but the last song in For The Throne album Pray (High Valyrian) sung by Matt Bellamy, borrowing Mel’s Valyrian prayer, has this as the lyrics: It didn’t go as expect in the last episode, but I like to believe this is what happen after Drogon took Dany’s body - taking her to the east where the red priestesses and priests resurrect her.
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