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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2016 10:20:49 GMT
They can't introduce whole new storylines without a main character, the Iron Islands with only Asha as an introductory vessel would not have worked for unsullied. There was honestly nothing wrong with the way they introduced Dorne, it makes sense in terms of adaptation, the real issues were in the execution. I suppose Stannis should have been introduced by Catelyn then. It can work, although i never said the way they introduced dorne was wrong. Also having jaime there did nothing for the unsullied they were still confused as fuck. He probably should have been tbh. Or he could've been in KL in s1. Both would've worked better. I remember my mum being confused as fuck when they cut to Dragonstone in ep. 201. And in his appearances until ep. 204. So, yeah, that would've helped.  |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2016 10:29:29 GMT
I suppose Stannis should have been introduced by Catelyn then. It can work, although i never said the way they introduced dorne was wrong. Also having jaime there did nothing for the unsullied they were still confused as fuck. He probably should have been tbh. Or he could've been in KL in s1. Both would've worked better. I remember my mum being confused as fuck when they cut to Dragonstone in ep. 201. And in his appearances until ep. 204. So, yeah, that would've helped. No he shouldnt have haha it would make no sense for him to be in KL. Everyone was confused at the start, but do you realise that it was okay after a few episodes? The audience doesnt need to be babied. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2016 10:30:35 GMT
And Ellaria was not an unfamiliar character.  |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2016 10:35:43 GMT
He probably should have been tbh. Or he could've been in KL in s1. Both would've worked better. I remember my mum being confused as fuck when they cut to Dragonstone in ep. 201. And in his appearances until ep. 204. So, yeah, that would've helped. No he shouldnt have haha it would make no sense for him to be in KL. Everyone was confused at the start, but do you realise that it was okay after a few episodes? The audience doesnt need to be babied. s2 did not consolidate screentime at all effectively. It was terribly-paced, particularly it's first two episodes. My point is that that is not something they should ever try emulating again. It's better to have an "in" to new storylines. Even if it had just been Ned's messenger arriving to meet Stannis and relaying the info that he did to him. Something like that with the connection made apparent in dialogue or the previously-on. But as Theon would say, "What's done is done."  |
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Post by breakfest on Jan 28, 2016 10:39:25 GMT
They can't introduce whole new storylines without a main character, the Iron Islands with only Asha as an introductory vessel would not have worked for unsullied. There was honestly nothing wrong with the way they introduced Dorne, it makes sense in terms of adaptation, the real issues were in the execution. I suppose Stannis should have been introduced by Catelyn then. It can work, although i never said the way they introduced dorne was wrong. Also having jaime there did nothing for the unsullied they were still confused as fuck. But he himself was a new main character being introduced, as were Davos and Mel. Introducing this side plot with only supporting characters doing things that only feel vaguely connected to the main plot without an invested, main character would have made no sense at all. The best compromise they could come up with, and I agree, was to send Jaime there in a quasi-Balon Swann role for this season. Then once a load of characters had died at the end of Season 5 (in particular Stannis' whole storyline) they could introduce two new larger storylines in the Riverlands and Iron Islands over one season. I think that's fine in principle, and they could have made that work, the real problem was in the execution of sending Jaime there, which was clunky, lacked interesting conflict and utilised under-developed characters. Turn that into more of a book-style Queenmaker plot with Arianne--->Ellaria and I think they could have made it much more engaging. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2016 10:40:45 GMT
And Ellaria was not an unfamiliar character. Thats what i was going to say as well. But i was not arguing about jaime and bronn being there. I actually think sending bronn there would have been a great decision...jaime not so much but thats for another discussion. The discussion is about Dorne being included in season 5 in the first place. To which i think we could have gone without if thinking about what it was in season 5, separate to what it could of been from the books. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2016 10:53:22 GMT
I suppose Stannis should have been introduced by Catelyn then. It can work, although i never said the way they introduced dorne was wrong. Also having jaime there did nothing for the unsullied they were still confused as fuck. But he himself was a new main character being introduced, as were Davos and Mel. Introducing this side plot with only supporting characters doing things that only feel vaguely connected to the main plot without an invested, main character would have made no sense at all. The best compromise they could come up with, and I agree, was to send Jaime there in a quasi-Balon Swann role for this season. Then once a load of characters had died at the end of Season 5 (in particular Stannis' whole storyline) they could introduce two new larger storylines in the Riverlands and Iron Islands over one season. I think that's fine in principle, and they could have made that work, the real problem was in the execution of sending Jaime there, which was clunky, lacked interesting conflict and utilised under-developed characters. Turn that into more of a book-style Queenmaker plot with Arianne--->Ellaria and I think they could have made it much more engaging. But Arianne, Doran and Ellaria could have been the new main characters. With one sand snakes and areo hotah as minor factors who then have a bigger role in season 7. I think there is interest there, if they had stuck to original plot points like dorans plan lol. It is interesting because it links with the lannisters, revenge for oberyn and upcoming events in KL. I agree with the second part. This story needed arianne. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2016 10:54:47 GMT
But he himself was a new main character being introduced, as were Davos and Mel. Introducing this side plot with only supporting characters doing things that only feel vaguely connected to the main plot without an invested, main character would have made no sense at all. The best compromise they could come up with, and I agree, was to send Jaime there in a quasi-Balon Swann role for this season. Then once a load of characters had died at the end of Season 5 (in particular Stannis' whole storyline) they could introduce two new larger storylines in the Riverlands and Iron Islands over one season. I think that's fine in principle, and they could have made that work, the real problem was in the execution of sending Jaime there, which was clunky, lacked interesting conflict and utilised under-developed characters. Turn that into more of a book-style Queenmaker plot with Arianne--->Ellaria and I think they could have made it much more engaging. But Arianne, Doran and Ellaria could have been the new main characters. With one sand snakes and areo hotah as minor factors who then have a bigger role in season 7. I think there is interest there, if they had stuck to original plot points like dorans plan lol. It is interesting because it links with the lannisters, revenge for oberyn and upcoming events in KL. I agree with the second part. This story needed arianne. Not with Aegon cut. Unless the suggestion is that he ought to have been included too.  |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2016 10:56:30 GMT
But Arianne, Doran and Ellaria could have been the new main characters. With one sand snakes and areo hotah as minor factors who then have a bigger role in season 7. I think there is interest there, if they had stuck to original plot points like dorans plan lol. It is interesting because it links with the lannisters, revenge for oberyn and upcoming events in KL. I agree with the second part. This story needed arianne. . Unless the suggestion is that he ought to have been included too. Why? |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2016 10:57:54 GMT
Not with Aegon cut. Unless the suggestion is that he ought to have been included too. Why? Because she'll marry his shortlived-ruling ass and burn with him presumably. His removal from the story necessitated hers. |
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Post by breakfest on Jan 28, 2016 11:00:14 GMT
But he himself was a new main character being introduced, as were Davos and Mel. Introducing this side plot with only supporting characters doing things that only feel vaguely connected to the main plot without an invested, main character would have made no sense at all. The best compromise they could come up with, and I agree, was to send Jaime there in a quasi-Balon Swann role for this season. Then once a load of characters had died at the end of Season 5 (in particular Stannis' whole storyline) they could introduce two new larger storylines in the Riverlands and Iron Islands over one season. I think that's fine in principle, and they could have made that work, the real problem was in the execution of sending Jaime there, which was clunky, lacked interesting conflict and utilised under-developed characters. Turn that into more of a book-style Queenmaker plot with Arianne--->Ellaria and I think they could have made it much more engaging. But Arianne, Doran and Ellaria could have been the new main characters. With one sand snakes and areo hotah as minor factors who then have a bigger role in season 7. I think there is interest there, if they had stuck to original plot points like dorans plan lol. It is interesting because it links with the lannisters, revenge for oberyn and upcoming events in KL. I agree with the second part. This story needed arianne. There's always concessions with these things though. Make them main characters and you need to give them more screentime to the detriment of others, it's a difficult balance. Not to say it couldn't have worked but I'm glad they didn't go that way. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2016 11:02:57 GMT
Because she'll marry his shortlived-ruling ass and burn with him presumably. His removal from the story necessitated hers. Her story has nothing to do with aegon in AFFC and ADWD actually. Things can be moved around, not sure why you cant grasp this. Especially since this is exactly what the show has done anyway. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2016 11:07:05 GMT
Because she'll marry his shortlived-ruling ass and burn with him presumably. His removal from the story necessitated hers. Her story has nothing to do with aegon in AFFC and ADWD actually. Things can be moved around, not sure why you cant grasp this. Especially since this is exactly what the show has done anyway. The whole thing is built up towards that meeting. And her early TWOW chapters will be the leadup to and the meeting itself. Which we could do without.
As for my grasping capabilities, maybe it's carpal tunnel. 
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2016 11:07:17 GMT
This all would have been so much easier if Arianne was Oberyn's eldest daughter.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2016 11:08:00 GMT
But Arianne, Doran and Ellaria could have been the new main characters. With one sand snakes and areo hotah as minor factors who then have a bigger role in season 7. I think there is interest there, if they had stuck to original plot points like dorans plan lol. It is interesting because it links with the lannisters, revenge for oberyn and upcoming events in KL. I agree with the second part. This story needed arianne. There's always concessions with these things though. Make them main characters and you need to give them more screentime to the detriment of others, it's a difficult balance. Not to say it couldn't have worked but I'm glad they didn't go that way. Im just using your own logic they arent exactly main characters, but neither were stannis, mel and davos imo. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2016 11:22:03 GMT
I think all this arguing proves that we need a trailer immediately.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2016 11:25:01 GMT
I think all this arguing proves that we need a trailer immediately. Yep. But with our luck it'll persist until Vinyl premiers.  |
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Post by boojam on Jan 28, 2016 11:25:10 GMT
Doran let his only son go with myrcella to kings landing. There's no plan, well nothing that resembles the book. My guess is Trystane gets killed and Doran sides with Daenerys when she comes to westeros. One more reason to see Winds of Winter. Just what does George want to do with Dorne? Dany , book wise, is aware of Dorne, well see if the show plays with this any. Since the sand snakes were introduced there is the possibility they will play their book roles. Nymeria was sent to sit on the small council. Tyene was sent to befriend the High Sparrow. Show wise these scenarios could happen , where they would go, god only knows. Obara Sand has a different mission in the books and it's not even set up on the show. So what she does is a mystery. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2016 11:34:22 GMT
I think all this arguing proves that we need a trailer immediately. Yep. But with our luck it'll persist until Vinyl premiers. Which I'll probably watch anyway because I think Terrence Winter is really good at creating compelling stories and also Scorsese is involved. But yeah it's looking to be that way, which I guess makes sense. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2016 11:37:47 GMT
Yep. But with our luck it'll persist until Vinyl premiers. Which I'll probably watch anyway because I think Terrence Winter is really good at creating compelling stories and also Scorsese is involved. But yeah it's looking to be that way, which I guess makes sense. Oh I don't blame Vinyl for that. Looks like a damn good show and it only makes sense to save the trailer until then. It's just a painful wait, is all. |
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