Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2015 17:16:18 GMT
Stannis is NOT OOC for his SHOW version. What his 'book version' is has absolutely no bearing on what he does in the show and never has. That doesn't mean that book Stannis isn't a complete asshole who still kills people. His motives are different sometimes, but here's the thing: It doesn't MATTER if he was 'reluctant' in burning his nephew in the books...he was still going to do it for religious reasons. Had he burned Edric, he would have been just as awful as if he had burned Gendry. Use all the caps lock you like, I still find what the show did AND the character despicable. No one has ever said what he did wasn't despicable... It was. But as Ramsay said: "If you think this story has a happy ending, you haven't been paying attention." I don't watch GoT or like ASOIAF because I want sunshine and roses. Horrible horrible things happen every chapter and every episode. It's a story that feels real for the time it's presenting. Like I said before: this gut punch you and everyone else is feeling is the same gut punch Unsullied viewers felt when the Red Wedding happened -- which was despicable too. They murdered a baby in that scene. |
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Post by Admin on Jun 10, 2015 17:16:39 GMT
As thrilled as I am that the opinion I share is 'load of crap', I have been a huge Stannis fan for years but that was character assassination and I never used that phrase before in my life or in that show, not even with Jaime. I went from loving Stannis to wishing he was dead already, so that's that. What "opinion"? I never pointed at you. I said that the idea that something is out of character and is "character assassination" literally makes no sense. Think about the real world and tell me you haven't known people to do things that were out of character for them. It happens. Real people aren't scripted. Scripted characters should be led with consequence and do things with good narrative timing. That BS had neither. Use all the caps lock you like, I still find what the show did AND the character despicable. You're supposed to. That's the point. But it's not OOC.That doesn't mean he didn't do despicable stuff in the books, even if his motives are different. History rarely cares about the motives people had when they did terrible things. Oh, but imho it is. |
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Post by Admin on Jun 10, 2015 17:18:59 GMT
Use all the caps lock you like, I still find what the show did AND the character despicable. No one has ever said what he did wasn't despicable... It was. But as Ramsay said: "If you think this story has a happy ending, you haven't been paying attention." I don't watch GoT or like ASOIAF because I want sunshine and roses. Horrible horrible things happen every chapter and every episode. It's a story that feels real for the time it's presenting. Like I said before: this gut punch you and everyone else is feeling is the same gut punch Unsullied viewers felt when the Red Wedding happened -- which was despicable too. They murdered a baby in that scene. Horrible people killed a baby during RW. A character who was so far one of the heroes of the story and hope of the North and refused to killed his child 2 episodes back, defended her every single time he could and spent a lot of effort to keep her alive when she was a baby, murders his own child and the only heir based on the words of a person who hasn't been 100% reliable to melt the snow. I fail to see any similarities here. |
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sj4iy
Grumpkin
"Et tu, Brute?"
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Post by sj4iy on Jun 10, 2015 17:24:24 GMT
You're supposed to. That's the point. But it's not OOC.That doesn't mean he didn't do despicable stuff in the books, even if his motives are different. History rarely cares about the motives people had when they did terrible things. Oh, but imho it is. Then we'll just agree to disagree. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2015 17:27:49 GMT
No one has ever said what he did wasn't despicable... It was. But as Ramsay said: "If you think this story has a happy ending, you haven't been paying attention." I don't watch GoT or like ASOIAF because I want sunshine and roses. Horrible horrible things happen every chapter and every episode. It's a story that feels real for the time it's presenting. Like I said before: this gut punch you and everyone else is feeling is the same gut punch Unsullied viewers felt when the Red Wedding happened -- which was despicable too. They murdered a baby in that scene. Horrible people killed a baby during RW. A character who was so far one of the heroes of the story and hope of the North and refused to killed his child 2 episodes back, defended her every single time he could and spent a lot of effort to keep her alive when she was a baby, murders his own child and the only heir based on the words of a person who hasn't been 100% reliable to melt the snow. I fail to see any similarities here. Stannis IS a horrible person. He's been burning people from day one. That's made him a horrible person. What is different between burning his daughter and burning his brother-in-law or murdering his brother? He's been horrible this whole time. But he's been the lesser of many evils that this show has presented. D&D even addressed it in that people never cared when he burned many of his bannermen, but no one batted an eye. And you don't see similarities between killing a child at the stake and killing a baby? They are the same thing, no matter what the motivation is. It's the murder of innocence. Which is a HUGE theme in the show and books. |
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Post by Admin on Jun 10, 2015 17:31:36 GMT
Horrible people killed a baby during RW. A character who was so far one of the heroes of the story and hope of the North and refused to killed his child 2 episodes back, defended her every single time he could and spent a lot of effort to keep her alive when she was a baby, murders his own child and the only heir based on the words of a person who hasn't been 100% reliable to melt the snow. I fail to see any similarities here. Stannis IS a horrible person. He's been burning people from day one. That's made him a horrible person. What is different between burning his daughter and burning his brother-in-law or murdering his brother? He's been horrible this whole time. But he's been the lesser of many evils that this show has presented. D&D even addressed it in that people never cared when he burned many of his bannermen, but no one batted an eye. And you don't see similarities between killing a child at the stake and killing a baby? They are the same thing, no matter what the motivation is. It's the murder of innocence. Which is a HUGE theme in the show and books. It's disturbing you ask that yet you see no difference between killing a brother who rebelled against you and killing your own innocent child. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2015 17:36:24 GMT
Stannis IS a horrible person. He's been burning people from day one. That's made him a horrible person. What is different between burning his daughter and burning his brother-in-law or murdering his brother? He's been horrible this whole time. But he's been the lesser of many evils that this show has presented. D&D even addressed it in that people never cared when he burned many of his bannermen, but no one batted an eye. And you don't see similarities between killing a child at the stake and killing a baby? They are the same thing, no matter what the motivation is. It's the murder of innocence. Which is a HUGE theme in the show and books. It's disturbing you ask that yet you see no difference between killing a brother who rebelled against you and killing your own innocent child. THEY'RE ALL MURDER. There is zero difference. Stannis is a murderer. There's no way to get around that. This isn't Ned Stark here. |
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Post by Admin on Jun 10, 2015 17:38:14 GMT
It's disturbing you ask that yet you see no difference between killing a brother who rebelled against you and killing your own innocent child. THEY'RE ALL MURDER. There is zero difference. Stannis is a murderer. There's no way to get around that. This isn't Ned Stark here. Caps lock and underlining words won't make them any more true, you know. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2015 17:39:53 GMT
Doesn't change that they are true, though.
Anyways, it's obvious that this is going nowhere. So I'll say adieu.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2015 17:41:30 GMT
It's disturbing you ask that yet you see no difference between killing a brother who rebelled against you and killing your own innocent child. THEY'RE ALL MURDER. There is zero difference. Stannis is a murderer. There's no way to get around that. This isn't Ned Stark here. Nearly every character is a murderer in Asoiaf. |
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Post by Admin on Jun 10, 2015 17:43:14 GMT
Doesn't change that they are true, though. Anyways, it's obvious that this is going nowhere. So I'll say adieu. You sure? You can still try this or this or this. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2015 17:43:24 GMT
Stannis? I still believe.
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Post by Admin on Jun 10, 2015 17:44:45 GMT
Apparently murder = murder, I suppose there is zero difference between Dany mercy killing Drogo and I don't know, Ramsay flaying that old lady to death.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2015 17:47:57 GMT
Apparently murder = murder, I suppose there is zero difference between Dany mercy killing Drogo and I don't know, Ramsay flaying that old lady to death. Killing in war is different from murder is different from euthanasia. That's called common sense. Keep up. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2015 17:49:47 GMT
THEY'RE ALL MURDER. There is zero difference. Stannis is a murderer. There's no way to get around that. This isn't Ned Stark here. Nearly every character is a murderer in Asoiaf. And your point? I've never said Stannis is the only one. Many of them are. Doesn't change the fact that Stannis isn't some moral man. |
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Post by Admin on Jun 10, 2015 17:51:39 GMT
Apparently murder = murder, I suppose there is zero difference between Dany mercy killing Drogo and I don't know, Ramsay flaying that old lady to death. Killing in war is different from murder is different from euthanasia. That's called common sense. Keep up.With what? |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2015 17:52:12 GMT
Damn it, after several days of thinking about this, I'm slowly figuring my mind out. I think I still support him, but I don't care for him as much as I did before. I have spent so much time and emotions on showStannis that it's really hard to hate him. All my anger on this issue is at D&D and not for Stannis.  But I still have to wait to see Stannis portray some anger and grief. He needs to grieve for her.. and then I have to hear what Davos has to say. That might take a year to hear.. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2015 17:53:42 GMT
Killing in war is different from murder is different from euthanasia. That's called common sense. Keep up.With what?  |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2015 17:53:43 GMT
Nearly every character is a murderer in Asoiaf. And your point? I've never said Stannis is the only one. Many of them are. Doesn't change the fact that Stannis isn't some moral man. Well. You mentioned Ned and he's a murderer, whether you like it or not. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2015 17:55:30 GMT
And your point? I've never said Stannis is the only one. Many of them are. Doesn't change the fact that Stannis isn't some moral man. Well. You mentioned Ned and he's a murderer, whether you like it or not. War is not murder. |
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