|
|
Post by boojam on May 4, 2015 11:02:21 GMT
So far in book 6 from the excepts Selmy is directing the battle to break the siege of Meereen. Grey Worm is leading an arm of the army. So both are play a roll in the start of Winds not clear they will be killed in the battle. Sorry, I didn't understand what you said... You mean that they might not have been killed? In the Winds of Winter they are, so far, alive. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 4, 2015 11:22:36 GMT
Finally, I'm surprised no one has mentioned the evil brothel worker who is helping the Harpies. She pointed the Unsullied into the ambush (and then gave a menacing look aftewards) and was distracting both the Second Sons who get murdered in this episode as well as the Unsullied who gets his throat slit in the premiere. I wonder if she still has a part to play this season, they've certainly made her presence and allegiance known in both these episodes. I think we discussed her briefly in episode one and some hypothesize that she may be the Harpy. Now, that we have seen her again in another attack against Dany's forces it's clear that she has a much larger role to play here. They would not have brought her back if it was a one-off thing. Being the show version of the Harpy/Green Grace would work. The role the GG had in the books was much more subtle but that's hard to do with the limited amount of screen time dedicated to the Meereen arc. Having her be an out and out villain is easier for the general audience to understand. I think it also seems like Hizzy is in league with her, given his speech at the time of the attack. On a completely different note. I think part of the reason they had Barristan die now was to have a parallel between Dany and Jon, both loosing an older mentor. |
|
|
|
Post by AdmiralKyrd on May 4, 2015 11:41:52 GMT
A lot of the critics to the Sand Snakes come from people (like me) who would've liked to see Arianne on the show, but in reality, they're not as bad as some say. On the other hand, their scene is not nearly on the same level of quality that this show usually is. If you go back a few seasons, the show has been spectacular in introducing and developing characters, even when its way diverges from the books' (I'm thinking about Tywin, Walder, Melisandre, Mance, Olenna, Margaery, Brienne...). I mean, if you watch Cersei with the High Sparrow, or Stannis with Selyse and Melisandre, and then jump to Ellaria and the Sand Snakes... It doesn't even seem like the same show. It's not that bad on itself, but it doesn't compare to the rest of it. I think the same applies to the homophobic sparrows at the brothel. I can't bite that they killed some gay nobles on the minute 1 of their newborn army. It feels very simple and cheesy compared to the show itself. Those were my problems with those two scenes. But still, I think we have to give more time to the Sand Snakes. They may be given more depth, specially if, as some speculate, they play a big role on the next season. You're absolutely right about this. I was going to write a compare and contrast analysis for the Sandsnakes vs Oberyn's introduction, but every single one of those was better, except I'd make the argument Mance's introduction on the show was pretty weak. We didn't really learn much new about him in his introduction. Even Ygritte gave us good info Mance wasn't a superhardass by telling Jon that Mance would let him in. |
|
|
|
Post by Admin on May 4, 2015 11:56:49 GMT
Apparently the Inside the episode video is about Shireen/Stannis scene. Anyone has a link?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 4, 2015 11:58:55 GMT
yes here it is!
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 4, 2015 13:51:37 GMT
I'm writing a strongly worded letter to the producers about Ser Barristan..
|
|
|
|
Post by King Tommen on May 4, 2015 14:06:07 GMT
Would the furore over Barristan dying at this point be as bad if it were known that he definitely bites it during the Battle of Meereen (which the show will not be depicting)? I like the character but if he's not destined to be by Dany's side on her trip to Westeros, then he's on borrowed time. At least he got to go down in a blaze of glory. I doubt that Martin's going to give him a massive hero moment during the Battle since I don't really think that's his thing. More than likely, Dany simply finds out he didn't make in the aftermath of the Battle. It could very well be that his POV TWoW chapter released is the last time we hear from him alive.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 4, 2015 14:18:25 GMT
That's certainly a possibility. It's one thing when you know a beloved character's death is coming. We knew about moments like the Red Wedding and the Oberyn/Mountain duel, and could prepare ourselves for them accordingly. This is different for a number of reasons. First, it's just difficult watching a character you love die when you didn't know it was coming. Second, it doesn't bode well for their future in the books. Ultimately, I'm not just saddened by his death, but by the fact that he's been underutilized for the past few years. It's a shame that his death is the first significant thing he's done since he defied Joffrey in the first season.
I can't speak for the others but my furor about Barristan isn't necessarily a criticism of the show but an emotional outlet to vent.
|
|
|
|
Post by Paid Debt Lannister on May 4, 2015 14:20:14 GMT
Would the furore over Barristan dying at this point be as bad if it were known that he definitely bites it during the Battle of Meereen (which the show will not be depicting)? I like the character but if he's not destined to be by Dany's side on her trip to Westeros, then he's on borrowed time. At least he got to go down in a blaze of glory. I doubt that Martin's going to give him a massive hero moment during the Battle since I don't really think that's his thing. More than likely, Dany simply finds out he didn't make in the aftermath of the Battle. It could very well be that his POV TWoW chapter released is the last time we hear from him alive. I doubt it. I'm pretty sure Barristan makes it out of the Battle alive, or dies at the hands of a worthy opponent (Victarion?). But my big guess is that, in the aftermath of the battle, when everything is "at peace", he gets betrayed by the Harpy (Green Grace? Shavepate? Missandei? UnRos? Hodor?) and dies poisoned or something like that. Then Daenerys hears of his death and burns Meereen to the ground, where it belongs  |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 4, 2015 14:21:14 GMT
Barry was destined to die in the Battle of Mereen. They had to kill him off some stage, but it still kinda feels that he did nothing on the show.
What was the point of Mel trying to seduce Jon?
|
|
|
|
Post by Paid Debt Lannister on May 4, 2015 14:22:59 GMT
That's certainly a possibility. It's one thing when you know a beloved character's death is coming. We knew about moments like the Red Wedding and the Oberyn/Mountain duel, and could prepare ourselves for them accordingly. This is different for a number of reasons. First, it's just difficult watching a character you love die when you didn't know it was coming. Second, it doesn't bode well for their future in the books. Ultimately, I'm not just saddened by his death, but by the fact that he's been underutilized for the past few years. It's a shame that his death is the first significant thing he's done since he defied Joffrey in the first season. I can't speak for the others but my furor about Barristan isn't necessarily a criticism of the show but an emotional outlet to vent. Yes, this is what bothers me. The guy did nothing in four seasons he appeared, other than dying. He could have fought the Meereenese champion instead of Daario, just so we could think "ok that's why he is important, he is a freakin badass". Nope, he fights masked goons in an alley and dies. After four seasons of build up to his skills. |
|
|
|
Post by King Tommen on May 4, 2015 14:23:19 GMT
Barry was destined to die in the Battle of Mereen. They had to kill him off some stage, but it still kinda feels that he did nothing on the show. What was the point of Mel trying to seduce Jon? Cuz she knows that he has King's blood and wants to make a shadow baby? She basically tells him that. |
|
Quoth
Sweet Summer Child
Posts: 123 
|
Post by Quoth on May 4, 2015 14:34:45 GMT
Props to Natalie for her acting. After trying to get Tommen to spring Loras and discovering she can't bend Tommen that far, you can see on her face her re-evaluation of the situation and her internal plotting working at warp speed.
|
|
|
|
Post by boojam on May 4, 2015 15:27:47 GMT
Yes, this is what bothers me. The guy did nothing in four seasons he appeared, other than dying. He could have fought the Meereenese champion instead of Daario, just so we could think "ok that's why he is important, he is a freakin badass". Nope, he fights masked goons in an alley and dies. After four seasons of build up to his skills. More concerned about Grey Worm , now that they have introduced and used the Unsullied there will have to be another leader. Can't see picking another actor or at least going through the trouble. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 4, 2015 15:55:07 GMT
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 4, 2015 16:13:29 GMT
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 4, 2015 17:44:19 GMT
Maybe D&D forgot to read every Meereen chapter after Daznak's Pit.
|
|
|
|
Post by King Tommen on May 4, 2015 17:49:36 GMT
Maybe D&D forgot to read every Meereen chapter after Daznak's Pit. Or they read it and said "Political intrigue with a number of characters with unpronounceable names that will never be heard from again while Dany is sidelined off-screen? Yeah, thanks, but no thanks." Of all things to cut from Dany's arc, this was by far the most obvious. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 4, 2015 17:56:08 GMT
Maybe D&D forgot to read every Meereen chapter after Daznak's Pit. Or they read it and said "Political intrigue with a number of characters with unpronounceable names that will never be heard from again while Dany is sidelined off-screen? Yeah, thanks, but no thanks." Of all things to cut from Dany's arc, this was by far the most obvious. True and it would have been too overwhelming for Unsullied to really give a shit. Barristan dying this early makes it seem like D&D want Dany to sail for Westeros in the finale or at least early Season 6. Which is good since she needs to leave Slaver's Bay, but Barristan could have at least survived until Daznak's Pit. Though I'm happy they are condensing the Meereen arc. Also, since they don't seem to be doing the Battle of Meereen, it would be cool if the Battle of Ice was the opening scene for Season 6, but I doubt it. |
|
|
|
Post by King Tommen on May 4, 2015 18:14:15 GMT
I think Daznak's has to be set up so there can't be a major character death involved because the climax is Dany getting on Drogon and flying off. How do you mix that with her needing to react to a trusted friend/advisor death? It would throw the scene off.
But you still need to up the tension in Daznak by making the Harpies a real threat and putting this scene in the middle of the season does just that. These guys have to look like they could take out anyone at any time and when they storm Daznak, full force, you should have the audience believing that Dany's going to take some serious casualties.
That, and understanding that Barristan is not going to be part of Dany's voyage to Westeros are probably the main reasons his death was done this way and at this time.
|
|
