Post by AdmiralKyrd on May 5, 2015 17:08:29 GMT
Some of you read a bit on my theory of Brienne's future arc a few weeks ago in the leaked thread, some of you might have missed it, or hadn't read it.
I'd like to take this to the public forums, but while I prepare that, I'd like to post a string of quotes and see if you can pick up on where I'm heading with it. I don't like to outright "spoil" something that might potentially happen. I like to post something that guides someone in a direction to possibly figure it out from the raw text, or at least what I think the show might be doing, before outright saying it.
To those who have read what I posted, shush. To those who haven't, take a stab at it. It involves parallels, connections, and specific words used.
There are two sections here. The first version is the straight excerpt of passages. Take the time to think it over. When you either think you see it or would like more hints, click the "spoiler" for the second part. The second bolds the important phrases to note.
Please don't take this out of this forum into the larger fanbase until I've had more time to draw up the proper presentation. And as feedback:
1. What did you think I was getting during each section?
2. Does this theory seem plausible?
3. Do you like this way of theory presentation of giving you a chance to put pieces together without any discourse, or would you rather something just be outright laid out as other posts/videos are? How does it compare for you?
------
BRIENNE: I can't knight you, but I can teach you how to fight.
POD: I suppose that's more important. You weren't a knight, but you were a Kingsguard to Renly Baratheon, weren't you?
BRIENNE: I was.
RENLY: Lord Tyrion said he was a good man.
BRIENNE: He was.
POD: But how did you end up serving Renly?
BRIENNE: When I was a girl, my father held a ball. I'm his only living child, so he wants to make a good match for me. He invited dozens of young lords to Tarth. I didn't want to go, but he dragged me to the ballroom. And it was wonderful. None of the boys noticed how mulish and tall I was. They shoved each other and threatened to duel if they thought it was their turn to dance. They whispered in my ear how they wanted to marry me and take me back to their castles. My father smiled at me and I smiled at him. I'd never been so happy. Till I saw a few of the boys sniggering. And then they all started to laugh, they couldn't keep the game going any longer. They were toying with me. Brienne the Beauty, they called me. Great joke. And I realized I was the ugliest girl alive. A great lumbering beast. I tried to run away, but Renly Baratheon took me in his arms. ‘Don't let them see your tears,’ he told me. ‘They’re nasty little shits and nasty little shits aren't worth crying over.’ He danced with me and none of the other boys could say a word. Renly was king's brother after all.
POD: But wasn't he … Lord Tyrion said he was-
BRIENNE: Yes, Pod, he liked men, I'm not an idiot. He didn't love me, he didn't want me, he danced with me because he was kind and he wouldn't see me hurt. He saved me from being a joke. From that day until his last day. And I couldn't save him in return. Nothing's more hateful than failing to protect the one you love. One day, I will avenge King Renly.
POD: But you said a shadow murdered him. How do you fight a shadow?
BRIENNE: A shadow with the face of Stannis Baratheon. I know it was Stannis. I know it in my heart. Stannis is a man, not a shadow. And a man can be killed.
SHIREEN: Are you ashamed of me, father?
STANNIS: When you were an infant, the Dornish trailer landed on Dragonstone. His goods were junk except for one wooden doll. He'd even sewn a dress on it in the colors of our House. No doubt he'd heard of your birth. And assumed new fathers were easy targets. I still remember how you smiled when I put that doll in your cradle. You pressed it to your cheek. By the time we burnt the doll, it was too late. I was told you would die. Or worse. The greyscale would go slow. Let you grow just enough to know the world before taking it away from you. Everyone advised me to send you to the ruins of Valyria to live out your short life with the Stone men, before the sickness spread to the castle. I told them all to go to hell. I called in every maester on this side of the world. Every healer, every apothecary. They stopped the disease and saved your life. Because you did not belong across the world with the bloody Stone men. You are the Princess Shireen of House Baratheon. And you are my daughter.
BRIENNE: My name is Brienne of Tarth.
PETYR: We've met, with Renly Baratheon. What did he say about you? He said your loyalty came free of charge. Someone appears to have paid quite a bit for it since then.
DAVOS: What's your life gonna be like here at the Wall, with Thorne in command?
JON: Unpleasant, I expect.
STANNIS: Your bravery made him look weak. He'll punish you for it. I don't punish men for bravery. I reward them.
JON: I don't doubt that, Your Grace. But I am a brother of the Night's Watch. I have pledged them my life, my honor, my sword. I don't know what I have left to give you.
STANNIS: You can give me the North.
JON: I can't. Even if I wanted to, I'm a bastard. A Snow.
STANNIS: Kneel before me. Lay your sword at my feet. Pledge me your service and you'll rise again as Jon Stark, Lord of Winterfell.
TYRION: The only red priest we had in King's Landing was Thoros of Myr. This one's much better looking. Stone men. Good luck stopping this spread of greyscale with prayer. You'd have better luck dancing away the plague.
Bolded Version Spoilered:
BRIENNE: I can't knight you, but I can teach you how to fight.
POD: I suppose that's more important. You weren't a knight, but you were a Kingsguard to Renly Baratheon, weren't you?
BRIENNE: I was.
RENLY: Lord Tyrion said he was a good man.
BRIENNE: He was.
POD: But how did you end up serving Renly?
BRIENNE: When I was a girl, my father held a ball. I'm his only living child, so he wants to make a good match for me. He invited dozens of young lords to Tarth. I didn't want to go, but he dragged me to the ballroom. And it was wonderful. None of the boys noticed how mulish and tall I was. They shoved each other and threatened to duel if they thought it was their turn to dance. They whispered in my ear how they wanted to marry me and take me back to their castles. My father smiled at me and I smiled at him. I'd never been so happy. Till I saw a few of the boys sniggering. And then they all started to laugh, they couldn't keep the game going any longer. They were toying with me. Brienne the Beauty, they called me. Great joke. And I realized I was the ugliest girl alive. A great lumbering beast. I tried to run away, but Renly Baratheon took me in his arms. ‘Don't let them see your tears,’ he told me. ‘They’re nasty little shits and nasty little shits aren't worth crying over.’ He danced with me and none of the other boys could say a word. Renly was king's brother after all.
POD: But wasn't he … Lord Tyrion said he was-
BRIENNE: Yes, Pod, he liked men, I'm not an idiot. He didn't love me, he didn't want me, he danced with me because he was kind and he wouldn't see me hurt. He saved me from being a joke. From that day until his last day. And I couldn't save him in return. Nothing's more hateful than failing to protect the one you love. One day, I will avenge King Renly.
POD: But you said a shadow murdered him. How do you fight a shadow?
BRIENNE: A shadow with the face of Stannis Baratheon. I know it was Stannis. I know it in my heart. Stannis is a man, not a shadow. And a man can be killed.
SHIREEN: Are you ashamed of me, father?
STANNIS: When you were an infant, the Dornish trailer landed on Dragonstone. His goods were junk except for one wooden doll. He'd even sewn a dress on it in the colors of our House. No doubt he'd heard of your birth. And assumed new fathers were easy targets. I still remember how you smiled when I put that doll in your cradle. You pressed it to your cheek. By the time we burnt the doll, it was too late. I was told you would die. Or worse. The greyscale would go slow. Let you grow just enough to know the world before taking it away from you. Everyone advised me to send you to the ruins of Valyria to live out your short life with the Stone men, before the sickness spread to the castle. I told them all to go to hell. I called in every maester on this side of the world. Every healer, every apothecary. They stopped the disease and saved your life. Because you did not belong across the world with the bloody Stone men. You are the Princess Shireen of House Baratheon. And you are my daughter.
BRIENNE: My name is Brienne of Tarth.
PETYR: We've met, with Renly Baratheon. What did he say about you? He said your loyalty came free of charge. Someone appears to have paid quite a bit for it since then.
DAVOS: What's your life gonna be like here at the Wall, with Thorne in command?
JON: Unpleasant, I expect.
STANNIS: Your bravery made him look weak. He'll punish you for it. I don't punish men for bravery. I reward them.
JON: I don't doubt that, Your Grace. But I am a brother of the Night's Watch. I have pledged them my life, my honor, my sword. I don't know what I have left to give you.
STANNIS: You can give me the North.
JON: I can't. Even if I wanted to, I'm a bastard. A Snow.
STANNIS: Kneel before me. Lay your sword at my feet. Pledge me your service and you'll rise again as Jon Stark, Lord of Winterfell.
TYRION: The only red priest we had in King's Landing was Thoros of Myr. This one's much better looking. Stone men. Good luck stopping this spread of greyscale with prayer. You'd have better luck dancing away the plague.
I'd like to take this to the public forums, but while I prepare that, I'd like to post a string of quotes and see if you can pick up on where I'm heading with it. I don't like to outright "spoil" something that might potentially happen. I like to post something that guides someone in a direction to possibly figure it out from the raw text, or at least what I think the show might be doing, before outright saying it.
To those who have read what I posted, shush. To those who haven't, take a stab at it. It involves parallels, connections, and specific words used.
There are two sections here. The first version is the straight excerpt of passages. Take the time to think it over. When you either think you see it or would like more hints, click the "spoiler" for the second part. The second bolds the important phrases to note.
Please don't take this out of this forum into the larger fanbase until I've had more time to draw up the proper presentation. And as feedback:
1. What did you think I was getting during each section?
2. Does this theory seem plausible?
3. Do you like this way of theory presentation of giving you a chance to put pieces together without any discourse, or would you rather something just be outright laid out as other posts/videos are? How does it compare for you?
------
BRIENNE: I can't knight you, but I can teach you how to fight.
POD: I suppose that's more important. You weren't a knight, but you were a Kingsguard to Renly Baratheon, weren't you?
BRIENNE: I was.
RENLY: Lord Tyrion said he was a good man.
BRIENNE: He was.
POD: But how did you end up serving Renly?
BRIENNE: When I was a girl, my father held a ball. I'm his only living child, so he wants to make a good match for me. He invited dozens of young lords to Tarth. I didn't want to go, but he dragged me to the ballroom. And it was wonderful. None of the boys noticed how mulish and tall I was. They shoved each other and threatened to duel if they thought it was their turn to dance. They whispered in my ear how they wanted to marry me and take me back to their castles. My father smiled at me and I smiled at him. I'd never been so happy. Till I saw a few of the boys sniggering. And then they all started to laugh, they couldn't keep the game going any longer. They were toying with me. Brienne the Beauty, they called me. Great joke. And I realized I was the ugliest girl alive. A great lumbering beast. I tried to run away, but Renly Baratheon took me in his arms. ‘Don't let them see your tears,’ he told me. ‘They’re nasty little shits and nasty little shits aren't worth crying over.’ He danced with me and none of the other boys could say a word. Renly was king's brother after all.
POD: But wasn't he … Lord Tyrion said he was-
BRIENNE: Yes, Pod, he liked men, I'm not an idiot. He didn't love me, he didn't want me, he danced with me because he was kind and he wouldn't see me hurt. He saved me from being a joke. From that day until his last day. And I couldn't save him in return. Nothing's more hateful than failing to protect the one you love. One day, I will avenge King Renly.
POD: But you said a shadow murdered him. How do you fight a shadow?
BRIENNE: A shadow with the face of Stannis Baratheon. I know it was Stannis. I know it in my heart. Stannis is a man, not a shadow. And a man can be killed.
SHIREEN: Are you ashamed of me, father?
STANNIS: When you were an infant, the Dornish trailer landed on Dragonstone. His goods were junk except for one wooden doll. He'd even sewn a dress on it in the colors of our House. No doubt he'd heard of your birth. And assumed new fathers were easy targets. I still remember how you smiled when I put that doll in your cradle. You pressed it to your cheek. By the time we burnt the doll, it was too late. I was told you would die. Or worse. The greyscale would go slow. Let you grow just enough to know the world before taking it away from you. Everyone advised me to send you to the ruins of Valyria to live out your short life with the Stone men, before the sickness spread to the castle. I told them all to go to hell. I called in every maester on this side of the world. Every healer, every apothecary. They stopped the disease and saved your life. Because you did not belong across the world with the bloody Stone men. You are the Princess Shireen of House Baratheon. And you are my daughter.
BRIENNE: My name is Brienne of Tarth.
PETYR: We've met, with Renly Baratheon. What did he say about you? He said your loyalty came free of charge. Someone appears to have paid quite a bit for it since then.
DAVOS: What's your life gonna be like here at the Wall, with Thorne in command?
JON: Unpleasant, I expect.
STANNIS: Your bravery made him look weak. He'll punish you for it. I don't punish men for bravery. I reward them.
JON: I don't doubt that, Your Grace. But I am a brother of the Night's Watch. I have pledged them my life, my honor, my sword. I don't know what I have left to give you.
STANNIS: You can give me the North.
JON: I can't. Even if I wanted to, I'm a bastard. A Snow.
STANNIS: Kneel before me. Lay your sword at my feet. Pledge me your service and you'll rise again as Jon Stark, Lord of Winterfell.
TYRION: The only red priest we had in King's Landing was Thoros of Myr. This one's much better looking. Stone men. Good luck stopping this spread of greyscale with prayer. You'd have better luck dancing away the plague.
Bolded Version Spoilered:
BRIENNE: I can't knight you, but I can teach you how to fight.
POD: I suppose that's more important. You weren't a knight, but you were a Kingsguard to Renly Baratheon, weren't you?
BRIENNE: I was.
RENLY: Lord Tyrion said he was a good man.
BRIENNE: He was.
POD: But how did you end up serving Renly?
BRIENNE: When I was a girl, my father held a ball. I'm his only living child, so he wants to make a good match for me. He invited dozens of young lords to Tarth. I didn't want to go, but he dragged me to the ballroom. And it was wonderful. None of the boys noticed how mulish and tall I was. They shoved each other and threatened to duel if they thought it was their turn to dance. They whispered in my ear how they wanted to marry me and take me back to their castles. My father smiled at me and I smiled at him. I'd never been so happy. Till I saw a few of the boys sniggering. And then they all started to laugh, they couldn't keep the game going any longer. They were toying with me. Brienne the Beauty, they called me. Great joke. And I realized I was the ugliest girl alive. A great lumbering beast. I tried to run away, but Renly Baratheon took me in his arms. ‘Don't let them see your tears,’ he told me. ‘They’re nasty little shits and nasty little shits aren't worth crying over.’ He danced with me and none of the other boys could say a word. Renly was king's brother after all.
POD: But wasn't he … Lord Tyrion said he was-
BRIENNE: Yes, Pod, he liked men, I'm not an idiot. He didn't love me, he didn't want me, he danced with me because he was kind and he wouldn't see me hurt. He saved me from being a joke. From that day until his last day. And I couldn't save him in return. Nothing's more hateful than failing to protect the one you love. One day, I will avenge King Renly.
POD: But you said a shadow murdered him. How do you fight a shadow?
BRIENNE: A shadow with the face of Stannis Baratheon. I know it was Stannis. I know it in my heart. Stannis is a man, not a shadow. And a man can be killed.
SHIREEN: Are you ashamed of me, father?
STANNIS: When you were an infant, the Dornish trailer landed on Dragonstone. His goods were junk except for one wooden doll. He'd even sewn a dress on it in the colors of our House. No doubt he'd heard of your birth. And assumed new fathers were easy targets. I still remember how you smiled when I put that doll in your cradle. You pressed it to your cheek. By the time we burnt the doll, it was too late. I was told you would die. Or worse. The greyscale would go slow. Let you grow just enough to know the world before taking it away from you. Everyone advised me to send you to the ruins of Valyria to live out your short life with the Stone men, before the sickness spread to the castle. I told them all to go to hell. I called in every maester on this side of the world. Every healer, every apothecary. They stopped the disease and saved your life. Because you did not belong across the world with the bloody Stone men. You are the Princess Shireen of House Baratheon. And you are my daughter.
BRIENNE: My name is Brienne of Tarth.
PETYR: We've met, with Renly Baratheon. What did he say about you? He said your loyalty came free of charge. Someone appears to have paid quite a bit for it since then.
DAVOS: What's your life gonna be like here at the Wall, with Thorne in command?
JON: Unpleasant, I expect.
STANNIS: Your bravery made him look weak. He'll punish you for it. I don't punish men for bravery. I reward them.
JON: I don't doubt that, Your Grace. But I am a brother of the Night's Watch. I have pledged them my life, my honor, my sword. I don't know what I have left to give you.
STANNIS: You can give me the North.
JON: I can't. Even if I wanted to, I'm a bastard. A Snow.
STANNIS: Kneel before me. Lay your sword at my feet. Pledge me your service and you'll rise again as Jon Stark, Lord of Winterfell.
TYRION: The only red priest we had in King's Landing was Thoros of Myr. This one's much better looking. Stone men. Good luck stopping this spread of greyscale with prayer. You'd have better luck dancing away the plague.
